Many libertarians have argued that government welfare stifles charity to the detriment of the community. Every time food stamps are introduced, a food pantry closes. When a free clinic opens a religious hospital closes. I would argue that both government welfare and charity are detrimental to the economy at large and to the individual. Think of dollars not so much as currency, but as units of work. A worker spends X number of hours working every week providing a valuable service people willingly exchange their hard earned money to consume. Labor has been provided by both parties with fiat currency exchanged to the benefit of both sides. It is a core tenant of free marketeers that all trades are mutually beneficial, otherwise both parties would not agree to the transaction. When we look at charity, we see that the transaction is inefficient. What I mean by that is the person providing the charity has provided monies, but has received no labor. It is the small scale equivalent of paying half the country to dig holes and the other half to fill them to provide 100 percent employment. A stimulus of one, if you will.
No one would argue that giving money to the homeless is anything but a consensual transaction. Although I have had a bum complain about how little of my money I gave him. However, I would argue it is harmful to society at large even though it is voluntary. Every dollar given to a panhandler, is a dollar not purchasing another person’s labor. The 5 bucks given to the nonproductive is 5 dollars not given to a waiter as a tip for a job well done. In effect, when you give money away, without insisting on a good or service in exchange, you are subsidizing and encouraging non-production and at the same time discouraging the productive. You get more of what you reward and less of what you punish. If the homeless were not supported by either government largess or well-meaning individuals, they would be forced to provide some form of good or service in exchange for currency or starve. That could be anything as simple as unskilled manual labor or as complex as choosing to improve their skills and earn a higher wage. Obviously, for this system to work, not only would welfare need to be abolished and private charity banned, but labor and minimum wage laws would need to be repealed. College and training programs would need to be deregulated and loan guarantees banished. Once labor becomes available at a lower cost, the price of goods and services would plummet, resulting in a lower income being required for a sustainable lifestyle. This would reward the savers for once. At this point you may be thinking “Of course I would like to see those shiftless bums get a job, but what about the disabled?” If you thought I would go soft here, you’ve badly misjudged me.
I firmly believe that unless a person is in a vegetative state, they can still provide valuable services. A person who is unable to walk but has use of their arms could answer phones, sort files or any number of simple clerical tasks. Obviously, they could learn to code if they want a higher salary. Even a quadriplegic could learn to be a translator, singer or voice actor. The same is true for those that have a mental disability. Bagging groceries, cleaning or dog walking are all valuable services for which people would willingly pay a reasonable wage. Not only is employing the differently abled a more efficient use of money than charity, it provides a sense of independence and self-worth to the individual. If people with disabilities are seen daily contributing to society, people wouldn’t pity them; they would see them as equals working their way through life, the same as them. You know who isn’t working their way through life?
The biggest reason to ban charity, is to destroy a vehicle for graft, corruption and nepotism. Many charities are nothing more than legal scams to collect vast amounts of wealth. I’m sure we can all think of a charity that claims to fight for a cause, but in reality is nothing more than a slush fund for the people of the board. I’m looking at you NRA and Wayne French last name. Other charities are nothing more than a thin veneer of legitimacy for bribing politicians. I would name a former presidential candidate’s charity, but I don’t fancy committing suicide by shooting myself in the back of the head…twice. Another function of large charities is to provide make-work jobs for relatives that are too stupid to function in society. I mean, won’t someone think of the trust fund kid’s phony baloney jobs? I’m looking at you Jay-Z and Beyonce. I’m sure many of you can name a charity that actually does some good, but I believe them to be the exception that proves the rule.
So that is why I don’t give money away anymore*. My cash is more efficiently spent on the productive members of society, so that they are around to provide services for others that wish to hire them. Charities that claim to use donations for some nebulous good cause, are more likely spending it on junkets and jet setting. One could make the argument that donating to a politician’s foundation is not really a donation, since one is expecting a return on that particular investment, but let us not get bogged down in semantics. Lastly, I have no intention of supporting the idle rich, although I do hope to become the idle rich with the money saved by not giving it away to charities.
I’ve kept this article short so you can more quickly and efficiently savage me in the comments section.
*Disclosure: I did give money to Glibertarians, but I consider that a voluntary service fee akin to a tip and not charity.
I’m okay with it
You know who isn’t working their way through life?
Politicians?
I wrote this without doing any research and after submitting, I found the only other people in favor of outlawing charity are communist, because charity would undermine communism.
at least they weren’t cyclists
*head butts Don*
Yeah, I can understand your argument but the banning part is a bridge too far. I’d rather we not go down the rabbit hole of banning things because it’s not a productive use of one’s money.
I am not in favor of outlawing charity. There are good ones out there but the charity circuit is almost exclusively grifters. You have to be careful who you give to.
Institute for justice
St. Judes
Shriners
My local Salvation Army
uh…..I am sure there are others but I don’t know who.
My favorite transparent grifter is the jewish guy who is trying to feed Russian Jews or starving people in Israel.
A big red flag for me is anyone using appeals to emotion to get you to feel guilty. They can fuck right off.
Good to know I’m not the only person out there who gets irritated by ASCPA commercials.
My favorite transparent grifter is the jewish guy who is trying to feed Russian Jews or starving people in Israel.
(((My))) wife used to get a kick out of those commercials. She thought it was hilarious that the commercials for the starving people in Africa only wanted something like $1 a day, but the Jews needed $25/meal.
I also am not in favor of eliminating genuine charities. I think the way to do it is to end special tax status for them. No exemption from property, income or other taxes and no tax deduction for giving money/goods to them.
I don’t know how you close scan charities without hurting real charities. I guess eliminating tax incentives would leave only the truly altruistic orgs.
This is a good place to start.
https://www.charitywatch.org/charities/
Here’s another one.
https://www.charitynavigator.org/
Both sites are garbage and their analysis is superficial. M&G vs Program is useless without context. But it’s as sacred to their algorithms as earnings per share is for publicly traded companies.
Best way is consumers punishing lying new orgs and rewarding legit ones.
The article appears to propose not making a distinction, but banning all charities.
That’s why it’s SLD. It’s not consistent with libertarian philosophy, but you try to make a case for it anyway. There is a kernel of truth in that money is better spent vs government confiscation or corrupt charities. I strongly believe improving the economy is the best way to help the most vulnerable populations.
Sorry, I didn’t mean it would eliminate scam charities. Scammers would set up fake businesses or embezzle or such.
What I mean is eliminate the incentive to set up non-profits that either shield funds or enrich the execs. If it’s a worthy cause, people can still give their own money.
I got it. I agree eliminating tax shelters is probably a good idea, then again you can’t have tax deductions without taxes.
I give money to St. Jude Children’s Research Hospital. Parents with good jobs can work hard and still have child with an illness they can’t afford to treat.
I’m not against charity at all. Bad things happen to people all the time. Helping those in need is neither subsidizing and encouraging non-production, nor discouraging the productive. No one chooses to get hit by a tornado.
I think you’re highlighting the existence of two (maybe more) classes of “charitable organization”.
One provides shelter/food/clothing/etc to those in need, another “raises awareness of breast cancer”.
Also, big shoutout to my friend Ayesha for proofreading this for me.
“It is a core tenant of free marketeers…”
Tenet, even. Tenants rent or otherwise provide labor in exchange for lodging. Tenets are like principles, only moreso.
Tenets are small mobile street sweepers.
My bad tennants are sweepers.
Tennants players go to France and play in the US Open
She only highlighted things, I had to make the corrections, so I probably missed it.
You mean the Glibs editorial staff doesn’t stripe your naked bum with a riding crop for every misplaced comma, or typo? How come you get special treatment, bro?
Uh Tonio, it’s you that is getting the special treatment, they thought you liked it.
Ted S. does that, I thought?
Also, if I had paid someone to do it, it would have no errors, proving charity is bad.
What about charities looking to find a cure for a disease?
Or trying to buy land for non-government parks?
If you look at the breast cancer people, they take in a ton of money and not much progress has been made with a cure. I’m skeptical that these charities move the needle because their is already the profit motive to find cures to any major diseases. Buying land for a park would still need to collect money for taxes and maintenance, so would probably need to charge admission, otherwise you run into the tragedy of the commons otherwise.
Scams and political activists. Oh, I repeat myself.
I don’t tip.
I will say that Real Charity must include obligation, or shame.
I would argue you should tip heavily to encourage more people to find employment. You only have so many dollars, so they should be put to productive use.
I say Mr. Brown is the only real libertarian.
The tipping clip is jest, because it has the same energy as “no charity”. Charity has its place, but we’ve watered it down in the name of “dignity”. Along the line, “charity” now means no-strings-attached. When there’s strings attached, the desperate person can look to see who they are willing to align with. If, in fact, they are desperate.
Dammit. Mr. Pink. MISTER PINK is the only real libertarian.
I would make another, more direct ‘Tarantino’ argument in favor of giving: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDiRZ2xx9xI
I mean, maybe, when I give, I am purchasing something.
“You get more of what you reward” is a sort of purchase.
Very much this
Some quibbles:
In the economic calculus, you are leaving out the satisfaction that ones gets from making progress for a cause that they care about. That makes it a positive economic transaction for the giver (provided the giving is voluntary). That is, the giver would rather generate the effect of their donation than have the money, then they are effectively buying that effect and have conducted a normal economic transaction the same as any other.
The value of the labor provided by a disabled individual may not be high enough to meet their basic needs. That is, on net some people might consume more than they can produce through no fault of their own. This is where charity is most appropriate.
I use to give money to homeless and charities and after learning about how inefficient charities and realizing you get more of what you reward wrt the homeless I changed my habits. Writing this I took it to the absurd by banning charity making it a SLD article. Now I’m sure there are some good charities l, but I would encourage you to bet them heavily. If giving mays you happy, absolutely you should do it.
Irt the disabled, I believe in a heavily deregulated market, they would be able to earn a living wage. Look at how many people live on a dollar a day. The disabled could earn far more than that.
I largely agree with you. That’s why they are quibbles. I don’t give to large charities, but I will be charitable on a personal and local level. We’re much better at determining who and how to help when we know the circumstances of problems and the direct results of our charity. It eliminates a lot of the graft. If I can cut someone off if they are not using the charity appropriately, it incentivizes better behavior on their part and ensures that I get the results that I’m paying for. If I dump a bunch of money in a huge coffer and don’t ever see or know of any accounting of how it is used then it’s likely that I’ve wasted the money and the only benefit will be me patting myself on the back.
As an aside, this is still better than the usual patting of themselves on the back that many do for spending other people’s money in wasteful ways, nominally to help with causes that they care about. Or even worse, giving their money to politicians who promise to spend other people’s money on causes that they care about and thinking that they’ve done the world some good. Or thinking that they are somehow virtuous for it.
In regards to the disabled, I would favor charity in the form of paying them more for the work they provide than it is worth. I fully agree with you that it’s important for everyone to work to pay their way through life. In addition to the benefits that their labor provides to those who are paying them, it’s terribly damaging to the psyche for a person to provide no value to those around him.
Thanks for the thoughtful comments.
I grow a large garden and produce much more than we can consume. Is it charitable to give the excess away, friends that often return the favor by giving back something we don’t produce. We don’t keep a ledger, we give because it would be wasted if we didn’t, some friends have less and can better use our excess.
I like to think its informal barter without the paper work. That’s what friends are for, one of my favorite old sayings, besides “Get off my property” as I have said to Jehovah’s Witnesses, people running for political office, etc.
I would favor charity in the form of paying them more for the work they provide than it is worth.
Would become labor law in the first year. And then mandatory for everyone else.
Do you want a $50 Minimum Wage, cause this is how you get a $50 Minimum Wage.
I do not give much to charity, but I make loans on Kiva regularly (which are made at a loss, so yes some of the money is charity) My only quibble with Kiva is that they seem to be moving more and more into the identity based categories (women, refugees) and away from what I use to make my loans, ie. am I loaning someone consumption money (which means I am enabling the person to spend future earnings today and therefore be LESS responsible and LESS able to improve their lot) or capital, (which can grow the pie, creating more wealth which the borrower can then use to grow their way to prosperity).
Yes, there are higher value (in terms of economic growth spurred by spending) ways to spend your money and lower, but not all charity is low value and not all selfish use is high value. For example I have dozens of games on the PC on which I am typing that I have either never played or played only for minutes. That money was spent in a way that gave me little or no benefit and gave the money to people who often used it in failing ventures.
On the other hand economic growth is a nice thing, but it is not my goal in any area except investment. If the food I purchase fills my belly and pleases my palate it has done its job even if the money is immediately used to buy precious goods for potlatch.
Sorry, I largely agree.
The one charity I give to is a volunteer ambulance service in my neighborhood. I think they do some good against the extortionary prices charged by the city’s ambulances. I don’t care who uses them; hell, I’d call them myself if need an ambulance.
I should add that I too disagree with any sort of ban.
right
I read “ban” as poetic license, and my agreement is that I think it’s fine for others and have no argument
for myself, I’m a St Jude guy 100%
Fun fact: Danny Thomas would lay under a glass coffee table so he could watch the prostitutes he paid have a poo.
here’s where he’s laid out today
you can see the dome from I-40
I so totally did not need to know that. But that explains so much about poor Marlo Thomas.
Thanks, buddy. Squadies (volunteer, unpaid, fire/rescue/EMS) people are some of the true heroes of our society.
Our oldest daughter is a Nurse-Practitioner in the ER of a small-town community hospital in Iowa. Her husband is an EMT and volunteer firefighter. His Dad is the chief of the nearby college town’s fire department.
Those people earn every damn penny they are paid. You should hear some of their stories.
Volunteer? Why isn’t that charity?
“Cough up the buck, ya cheap bastard, I paid for your goddamn breakfast.”
Every dollar given to a panhandler, is a dollar not purchasing another person’s labor. The 5 bucks given to the nonproductive is 5 dollars not given to a waiter as a tip for a job well done. In effect, when you give money away, without insisting on a good or service in exchange, you are subsidizing and encouraging non-production and at the same time discouraging the productive.
The pan handler isn’t going to burn that money. The 5 bucks will enter the market soon enough.
A gift is a gift is a gift. Something given with no expectation of something in return. It doesn’t matter what the gift is or who it is given to. So long as the gift is given freely instead of through coercion, there is no downside to giving anyone a gift.
Except it’s inefficient. The fedgov doesn’t burn our tax dollars, but they sure piss them away. By purchasing something you need/want you are signaling the market to produce more.
Gifting has nothing to do with efficiency. It is irrelevant.
^This.
Yeah, this is the gaping whole in your argument. “Efficient” by whose definition? That’s a qualitative judgment about how my time/property/money should be spent. What if I want to give to fund a Buddhist monastery – to help people live ascetic lives. The very definition of what will constitute “charity” is laden with judgments about what’s “productive” or not. Do we get to compel the Amish to use technology, too?
What this article really is about is 501(c)s – and you’re right. Every single time I’ve asked or looked into one’s books, they fold up and go home. Or there’s fraud. Hell, the NFL League office, paying Roger Goodell a cool $44MM, only recently dropped its “non-profit” status. The NCAA is a non-profit. etc.
BUT – abolishing gifts and charity is tantamount to a war on virtue. What if someone doesn’t want to be homo economicus? (Assuming that you’re not really serious, you make fair points).
The panhandler will invest the money locally and quickly, keeping the free market humming
But it sends the market signal you need more malt liquor Instead of something you want.
We don’t?
Fourscore craves bees.
When you run out of tha Claw and ban the vaping the kids are going to get creative.
*tears up*
God bless, America!
OMG, yes. Waves tiny American flag. Wet-willies Rufus.
The only banning I support is Mike.
*gaze narrows*
Mike, who?
You. Personally, I would have gone with Hyperbole. You’re actually right, now and then.
Taking away minimum wage, labor laws, and government funding is one thing.
Banning what private citizens may do is not something I can agree with.
Well, I suppose I should refresh more often.
The Girl Scouts already figured a way around my ban. Sell cookies.
Keebler has an answer to every overpriced box.
Odds they’re all made in the same factory?
100%
“Charity is injurious unless it helps the recipient to become independent of it.”
– John D. Rockefeller
The amount of “beggar letters” my gf gets is astounding.
I’m good with some donations, but they smell blood in the water with her.
Can I have her address?
Thanks.
1313 Mockingbird lane
Mockingbird Heights, CA
Is her name Marilyn?
“It is a core tenant of free marketeers that all trades are mutually beneficial”
A core tenant of free marketeers is someone who pays his rent.
I wasn’t gonna say it, but … yeah. Tenet.
loose lose and tenant tenet are my personal IQ tests. I can’t help it, if you mess those up (or a few cliches people get wrong in ways that show they do not understand the saying) I have a hard time attributing it to a moment of inattention or typo. Apostrophes don’t bug me, spelling errors don’t bug me or there/their your/you’re errors because they are not thinking errors they are rote errors. If you call a person looser you may be commenting on their sexual selectivity but you are not saying anything about their success rate.
Sorry Florida Man :). It is my personal Ted S OCD area.
Sorry Florida Man :). It is my personal Ted S OCD area.-
I don’t mind. I came up in Florida public schools, so didn’t really get a good base education and my college career didn’t require much English/Grammar/writing. If I can get my general idea across, I’m happy.
What?
LOLOLOL
New one I’ve seen around:
scrap/scrape
Cutting dry/cut and dry, the meaning is so cut and dried I can’t understand the error.
I have never seen that, but then I haven’t been cruising Reddit lately, either. LOL
Whinging? how about Whining?
British English versus American English.
I have a real problem with books written by/published by English authors/publishers, then the “American” version comes out with “trunk” where “boot” should be and suchlike. Like we’re too stupid to know that the English might have different words for things.
Whinge is better just like arse is better, as is the Scottish/Irish habit of calling everyone a cunt ( not a cunte, mind you there is a difference) oh and calling it ‘half seven’ instead of 6 or 7 thirty. great stuff all.
Whinging and whining are two separate things.
One change I wish more editors would make is that the Brits use revolver as a synonym for pistol. In mystery stories this leads to detectives finding ejected brass from revolvers at murder scenes which makes me contemplate murdering the author/editor. If I ever succumb to this impulse I will make sure to use a revolver so as not to eject any brass at the scene.
Whinging and whining are two separate things.
Please explain, so I can stop getting annoyed.
Well, about that anyway…
revolver as a synonym for pistol
really? maybe you’ve merely stumbled upon a couple of idiot writers or editors?
When some one whinges it can often sound like a whining to others and hence the confusion.
Whining
My people pronounce the “wh.” It throws most Americans off, as if I’m making fun of them.
I suppose it could simply be erroneous usage, but I have seen it in several writers who ordinarily research carefully including Agatha Christie.
” If you call a person looser”
You may know too much about their toilet habits
Jar, what about the current “of” syndrome? “Would of”, “could of”, “should of”.
I’m almost for allowing this so-called charity ban, if we can secure an allowance to throw beatings on those who use this grammatical nonsense.
I often and knowingly use “coulda” colloquially, as in I coulda been a winnah, rather than could have. Its the rural spoken dialect
whudda cudda shudda been a contenda
I’m just happy you read the article. ??
Yanno, I totally forget to compliment and praise my kids when they do well and it embarrasses me when I’ve picked nits but said nothing a out the rest of it.
So, I found this a really great article.
Thanks!
I agree. The article makes several excellent points.
Dammit, MJ. Why you have to be the angel of my better nature?
Okay, Florida Man. You’re in. But I better hear more “harumphs” from you, going forward.
*hangs head in shame*
“Hedley Lamar” ROFLMAO. Okay, then.
*gives Tonio Harrumph*
Robyn Hilton
WOULD
Well, I’m just being a good Catholic.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theological_virtues
“I’ve kept this article short so you can more quickly and efficiently savage me in the comments section.”
How charitable of you.
It was noticed, what you did there.
One of the only “charities” I support regularly – at least once annually – is the Women’s Bean Project in Denver. They hire women who face challenges getting jobs due to various issues – addiction, past trouble with the law, etc. – and train them for real job skills. The employees learn all the different tasks involved with running a retail business, from assembling their various products – which started as just bean soup mixes and has expanded into a variety of food products – to taking orders, to shipping them out, to keeping records, etc. The ultimate goal for their employees is to find jobs out in the “real world.” And for the record, I’m sure the same model could work with men and/or a “co-ed” program.
I like that instead of just making a donation, I’m buying a product I want and like. (We use their 10-bean soup mix in our annual New Year’s Day “Hopping John” stew.) At the other end, the recipients aren’t getting a “handout” but a paycheck for productive work.
I would not really call that “charity” because you are purchasing something you want. Part of the product is knowing you are helping people who need it.
I think there’s a fuzzy line. It’s not charity, but I guess targeting spending to help others out. Someone, maybe Brooks?, gave a name to it not too long ago. Workity, maybe?
There’s a guy I give cash to in return for helping me out with jobs. For a variety of reasons (lack of DL, prison time, etc), he couldn’t get a regular job and that helps him survive while picking up other odd jobs. I absolutely benefit in turn, but always keep him on during even during winter when I don’t really need any help and it does sting a bit. Money is fungible, so he’d be let go if I regularly gave that money instead to a Big Name charity. And then he’d need to find charities for food, heating fuel, etc.
We also anonymously donate cash or items to others in our local community as we come across the opportunity. Things like donating to a neighbor who’s young child suddenly died and had no money for the burial. Or buying shoes with a favorite character for a pediatric patient of my wife’s who showed up to appt without shoes (broken family, lived with very poor grandparents). Or dropping off large bags of dog food to the local animal shelter. Things for people/animals that are in serious need and can’t help themselves even if willing.
I’ve given money to help with burial expenses a few times, help friends get back on their feet, stuff like that. I’m not going to tell them to paint my house or wash my car, because people do need help and I can afford it. I don’t give to any of those big charities that send out envelopes begging for money.
‘ burial expenses”
As I have but most often anonymously. It’s not charity if you have to wave a flag
Well, I’ve helped a few strippers through college, if that’s what you mean (not really, but it sounds kinda cool?)
I had my own women’s bean project, in the eighties/nineties.
Euphemism?
They were flicked, yes.
“Women’s Bean Project”
Totally not where I thought that was going. I had my flicking finger all ready to help the cause.
I just hope people are googling “why would you flick your bean?”
DuckDuckGo, but…yeah. ::hangs head::
Sokay, everybody does it sometimes.
They are too busy buffing their muffins.
A friend of mine called me some years back. She was devastated. Her 3 year old girl had tested positive for Job’s syndrome.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperimmunoglobulin_E_syndrome
In a nutshell it meant a short, hellish life for a child too young to understand what was happening to her. Mom had no idea how to handle it as she could not afford even the most basic medical care the child needed.
Long story short: I called both St. Judes and Shriners. Both took the child and gave her first class treatment regarding their areas of expertise at zero cost to the family, no hesitation, no questions asked.
I give to both and consider it money well spent. Yes, spent, not given away.
I think someone else here touted their experience with Ronald McDonald house. Based on what they said I need to add them to my list.
More cynicism and oversight is needed regarding charities, but banning is a not so good idea. Baby and bathwater…..
Banning is never the answer, period. The obvious answer to poverty/homelessness is to ease all restrictions on making money. That means licenses, petty victimless crimes, minimum wages and most other labor laws, removing any ban on anything which doesn’t harm another’s rights, etc. Also, BAN camping on sidewalks and in cities, littering, leaving needles and feces in public, and shaking down innocent people. Go camp in the woods and live off squirells, dammit.
Agree, but not my woods.
I don’t really believe in banning, it was a mental experiment in how to get the best results. Obviously there are certain people that have no way of providing value in equal exchange, those with severe mental and physical handicaps, children, etc. the one takeaway I hope people get out of this is knowing it’s okay to spend money on goods/services because it does help the recipient and if they are giving money away, to know damn sure how it will be spent.
I agree to this wall of text, you have convinced me to never give my money away again. I am guilty of giving lighters to motel people, they usually spark a blunt, so fair exchange
Btw, It’s a good article and I’m with you mostly. Thanks for writing it.
You know what I don’t like about government taking over the “charitable” functions other actors in society used to do?
It’s simple — we’re outsourcing compassion. Nothing good can come of taking an essentially human and individualistic sentiment and bureaucratizing it.
Those programs aren’t designed to help anyone. They are designed to skim money and provide government jobs.
I agree.
Gooberment and compassion should never be used in the same sentence.
And a nice article FM, thanks,
*raises a tall can*
Anyone remember this?
Nice. That’s the second time someone posted a Milton quote on something I thought was an original thought.
I can’t believe that’s only 15 years ago and not 30. It may be a rehash.
Of subterranean wind transports a Hill
Torn from Pelorus, or the shatter’d side
Of thundring Aetna, whose combustible
And fewel’d entrals thence conceiving Fire,
Sublim’d with Mineral fury, aid the Winds,
And leave a singed bottom all involv’d
With stench and smoak:
Catch the scent of an actual Milton quote.
OT: last (British) football season, I occasionally updated the (mis)fortunes of the Fort William Football Club which plays in the (Scottish) Highland Football League. Last season, they finished on -7 points having been penalized 9 points for ineligible players, drawing 2, and losing 32 of their 34 games and finishing with a goal average of -224 (scoring 21 and conceding 245).
Well, fair’s fair. Today they won for the first time in 75 games, defeating Clacnacuddin, 1-0: https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/49670484
Bonus point to anyone who can pronounce “Clachnacuddin”.
This is the fallacy of equivocation: a charitable donation is not a trade in the same way that a mother feeding her infant milk is not a trade. In both cases, they are acts of loving-kindness, indeed, that is what the root word of “charity” means. Now, one might argue that a parent cares for their children with the expectation that those children will care for them in their old age. Now this do ut des relationship is particularly apparent in East Asian culture, so we can say that it is a kind of investment. However, this does not invalidate the argument, as charity to the poor can be seen as a kind of “do ut des” investment, in that you provide money, willingly and at your discretion, to the destitute as an investment hoping that they will be prevented from reaching a rock-bottom level of desperation that could lead them to crime (like mugging you) in the future.
Or that should things go pear shaped others will be charitable when you may need it.
SHUT THE FUCK UP, LIBTARD!
I think an argument could be make that kind acts among friends and family “buys” you a social network that can provide tangible benefits, such is help with labor, community defense and a safety net. Charity for the poor, I think my original argument stills stands that providing employment is a better defense against crime vs handouts.
Now, one might argue that a parent cares for their children with the expectation that those children will care for them in their old age. Now this do ut des relationship is particularly apparent in East Asian culture, so we can say that it is a kind of investment. However, this does not invalidate the argument, as charity to the poor can be seen as a kind of “do ut des” investment, in that you provide money, willingly and at your discretion, to the destitute as an investment hoping that they will be prevented from reaching a rock-bottom level of desperation that could lead them to crime (like mugging you) in the future.
I am not sure if you are actually arguing this or just dealing with a potential counter argument to your initial point but I think you had the truth at :
This is the fallacy of equivocation: a charitable donation is not a trade in the same way that a mother feeding her infant milk is not a trade. In both cases, they are acts of loving-kindness
Human beings are not purely economic animals. We have motivations other than efficient exchange. Love, compassion, duty whether civic, personal (honor based), or religious, even signalling virtue all motivate behavior and the Psychological/sociological/economic academic contortions of thought used to bring those areas under the various rubrics desired are rationalizations. We do things for complex reasons that don’t fit universally applicable theories.
That was a question I immediately had upon reading this. Helping a family member or friend in trouble is different how? Is it simply that giving strangers charity is wrong? As usual, the gray edges is where it gets sticky.
So I should pay the filthy hippie busker to sing some shitty jimmy buffet song (but I repeat myself) or, even worse, a shitty cover of a good song instead of just giving him a buck to sit there and keep his yap shut? No sir, I can’t subscribe to your newsletter.
That is an interesting question. In my case, I look at it like this: Does this entertainer make me stop and listen for a while? Does he entertain me?
If so, money goes in the hat.
That’s the real answer. If you watch a street magician you should put money in the hat.
Fucking right. But then, the person is actually working for a living. So not charity.
Special place in heaven for you, young lady.
Fun story: Mr. GT was playing for tips at the neighborhood farmers’ market a few weeks ago when a teenage-ish kid who’d been hanging around nearby grabbed Mr. GT’s tip bucket and took off across the (busy state highway) street. Mr. GT gave chase, still carrying his guitar, along with a bunch of vendors and customers. Kid dropped virtually all of the money, and chasers retrieved it off the street. Kid also ran out of his Nike flip-flops, which we still have. Mr. GT probably got all his tips back, then a bunch more AND a bunch of free food from various vendors.
Someone suggested Mr. GT hire the kid to do it every time he’s scheduled to play.
Someone suggested Mr. GT hire the kid to do it every time he’s scheduled to play.
*single tear of joy rolls down cheek*
I hate thieves.
So I suggest you boobytrap the tip bucket.
Gold!
I was thinking about busking, does it pay at all?
I’m good at holding a crowd solo,
Location, location, location. Mr. GT’s farmers’ market gig is by arrangement with the market coordinator, and they even provide the canopy under which he sets up, so more formal than busking. We’re perilously close to Yellow Springs, Ohio, which is kinda Little Berkeley East, so informal street busking is common. Friends of ours who live there or nearby do it sometimes. We also regularly see either a steel drum player or harmonica player on the plaza outside the minor league ballpark, though not so much lately. Local PTB may have cracked down there. So whether you make much may depend on whether it’s a part of the local culture.
There are a ton of these in the NYC subway, and yeah they range from sanctioned acts in the major stations who get big crowds, to randos in neighborhood stations like mine who I think aren’t sanctioned, to “traveling” acts who roam the trains like regular bums.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPITKZ0Fgfc
I found it to be a fun watch, but I’m biased because I adore Mary Spender.
Fun indeed! They went all out with the gear. Any money you make gigging is really pay for hauling/setting up/tearing down the gear – in our case, it was from basement to car, car to stage, stage to car, car to basement. Getting to play in between is the perq.
I’d think it would be rough to busk in a big city, where so much of the public is probably jaded on the whole idea and they’d just as soon you weren’t in their effing way. That’s why a crunchy groovy little hippie town like Yellow Springs seems so ideal.
No you pay him to let you kick him in the nuts. Do you even libertarian, bro?
I don’t vote, does that count?
Good enough for me.
I get what you are saying, but I’ll still give to charities. I actually think it can be a quite effective way to get funds directly to people who are actually getting shit done (or trying to).
I’d rather be the one making the decisions than laundering money through Washington or St. Paul.
We still give out food and toiletries in bags to homeless that will take them, all donations, and better than cash,
Yeah, I get it.
I have no problem giving to no-kill shelters, though.
Pups are better than people 🙂
All my best to Bella!
Bella licks your face! She’s just glad walk in sub 100 degree temps,
Thanks Tundra
Jaws is on AMC right now. Man, what a great movie.
There is a movie called Man? because you cannot possibly be saying that Jaws is great.
There’s a song called Man, which w great because of Neko Case :
Man https://g.co/kgs/FHfpcz
A true classic. One of the best.
For the immortal line ‘Some boats are more bigger than others’ alone.
I thought that was from Animal Farm by Dostoyevsky?
Grapes of Wrath by Heinlein.
We’re gonna need a bigger thread….
I think the rubber will stretch
Yeah, that’s what she said…
Dad?
Nice.
This is why it never gets old here.
That shark is totally gonna get Richard Dreyfus in that cage.
I give zero money to bums and have not done so in more than a decade. I do live in bum central (although my part of the city is not nearly the pants dropping place of commentator derision).
Years ago on Haight Street I was coming out of a pizza slice place and saw a guy with a “Hungry, Please Help” sign. I shook my head. The girl who came out after tried to give the take away slice of pizza she had boxed up. The bum refused it. “I’m good on pizza, trying to get a burger.” I had to laugh my ass off at that one. Fuck bums.
Bro, if you gave bums money, you’d have to join them. It’s like all the LA bums living in the same ten blocks. Used to love going up there, too, dammit.
Ha! Most of the ones here have better tents than I do, but as much as I like camping I think I’ll stick to mostly indoor living.
Like yourself, I have constant interaction with Streer people due to my city and the job that I have. Mostly I am polite and let them be, but even my polite self has almost gotten into it a few times with them.
Don’t know why autocorrect changed “street” to capitalized Streer. Never heard of Streer’s.
Used to go visit my mom. She lived at mission and sixth. This was late eighties, early nineties. It was pretty bad back then. Time a quadrillion now. Back then it was homeless pets that earned concern and charity. Innocent times.
Damn, that’s rough. 6th and Mission has been brutal for as long as I can remember and I’m in my forties.
Yeah, I got sick of their shit many years ago. They get nothing from me. I dated a guy once who claimed it was (((his))) duty to give something to anyone who asked – so he gave a quarter every time. He was a flaming lefty from the richest town around Boston. Didn’t last.
Didn’t last.-
Ran out of quarters?
Rhy discovered that it was, in fact, a roll of quarters in his pocket.
Nicely done trashy.
Coworker once rolled her window down at an intersection and told one of those ‘work for food’ guys she had some work for him and she was earnest. She would pay him well. His response? “Fuck you lady. Give me some money!”
Last year one of those guys was sitting at an intersection in a wheel chair. A guy in a truck next to him rolled the window down and tossed half of a handful of coins on the street in front of wheelchair guy. Wheelchair guy squirmed around in his chair painfully. the light turned green and we all drove away. 30 yards past the wheelchair I looked in the rearview. Wheelchair guy hopped up like a cricket and gathered up the coins.
*A week later I saw cops loading wheelchair guy’s chair in the trunk of a cruiser and he was belly up against the cruiser hands cuffed behind his back.
The street beggars are all two-bit grifters. Never give them money.
Yep. In a rare moment of legitimate journalism, the Denver Post followed around a group of them for a year to see what it was all about. 100% of them were drug addicts with no interest in getting clean. One young woman had a family back in Wisconsin who constantly got in contact with her to try and get her to come home and get into rehab. She had no interest whatsoever.
Meh, that’s an insult to grifters, two-bit or otherwise. Those people are panhandlers, a little false advertising is expected. Now a grifter, he has a con or three working, hes playing angle you don’t even see. If you know, even if you don’t want to admit it, that your being took, that’s not a grift.
Yep, whenever I hear about the “homeless” problem I get a bit mad. At least here it is 90% not about having a “home”. There is a certain small percentage down on their luck, but those aren’t the ones causing problems. They usually live in vehicles and keep their stuff together. The vast majority is about hardcore drug addiction, criminals and mental illness.
This is why I require bums to do a song and dance routine before I give them my spare change.
Bummist!
No, dude. I don’t need them to put on blackface. That would be wrong.
Blackface, or the plague?
Google tried to correct Blackface, fuckers!
They missed some:
https://www.google.com/search?q=al+jolson+blackface&client=ms-android-samsung-gs-rev1&prmd=inv&sxsrf=ACYBGNRfK00woV6qRzMwbefFBOP8MBHzGg:1568253617563&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiKmav-l8rkAhXmT98KHT8RByoQ_AUoAXoECBIQAQ&biw=360&bih=612
Or at least a bum fight.
Bummist! Homeless have the right to shit in the street like anyone else!
Are they free to gambol?
Yes, they are now that those evil Ubers aren’t on the street anymore.
Ride their machines, without getting hassled by the man? Get high?
Working in fraud investigations, there are two groups I’ve learned to distrust more. The government and charity. Granted I already had distrust for the government when I got into my field.
This could be a great article, man. Particularly on the charity side.
I’ve thought about writing up some of my stories, but I have to be careful what I say.
Be vague. For people involved in managing charitable trusts, it could be spectacularly helpful.
You do you man. I don’t have a problem with charity as long as it’s voluntary, but it’s not as if your points are invalid. Do whatever you want with your money.
*tucks a dollar into Q’s pocket*
You’re a good kid.
Gee thanks Mister!
He’ll just use it to get titties
Good, I was afraid he’d waste it.
I spent most of my money on motorcycles and women, the rest, I wasted.
See below.
My wife has multiple handicaps, when I told her about this article she like, learn to code, duh…
L
I
F
T
M
E
B
A
L
L
S
LIFT ME BALLS?
Man, find a bum, or someone needy!
Good work…everyone.
Actchually, last letter was supposed to be a “Z”. But we’ll take the win.
A little charity for you.
https://archive.li/Piu9j/1c663f5d43378fa2ec49aada19bba68081e20ffb.jpg
NSFW.
https://archive.li/wE4Ks/8d6c2f1da7744669c33cc2380f2e345c18d08a19.jpg
NSFW.
Pick your favorite!
http://archive.li/UlyV3
Ginger just right of 6 o’clock.
NSFW.
This makes me want to rock around the clock.
OK, this is the first time I’ve ever picked up my computer and rotated it around in 16 steps.
Charity
Hope
Faith
Someone’s been listening to King’s X.
I’d throw something her way, but it’s more akin to tipping than charity
Just the tip, right?
More than 25%?
Bruce Hornsby Shrugged
Marc Cohn Flinched
*Punches Marc in arm*
I don’t get either reference.
That’s just the way it is, Ayn.
Some things will never change…
Dammit.
Some things will never change.
I don’t believe it.
I like this. I have marked it to read tomorrow when sober. I suspect that I will own the comments at that time.
You will, one handful of change at a time, you will own them. Rightfully.
More importantly, you’ll be first.
Fucking idiots.
https://www.nextgov.com/analytics-data/2019/09/study-more-half-americans-trust-law-enforcement-use-facial-recognition-responsibly/159770/
You can’t blame them since the media covers up every shady thing they do.
Unless there is a racial angle.
The “thin blue line” is blood poisoning, fix it before it kills again.
I’ll say it again. It’s not a thin blue line. It’s long brown streak.
::Quietly covers back window sticker::
It’s, ahem….actually gold.
https://i2.wp.com/img0.etsystatic.com/121/0/10546353/il_340x270.922388200_pnmj.jpg
Fat blue donut filled wall of silence
We’re fucked aren’t we? How can people be this stupid?
Any disclosures that the study was paid for by police and/or the companies that make the tech?
bullshit
I miss the old cfc based spray bottles. Now that I live in a mosquito preserve benadryl spray is a daily use item and the stupid pump sprays do not work worth a damn.
So, is this considered “charity”?
https://www.crowdjustice.com/case/dc-millers-case/
Would travel costs to England to punch Luke Turner repeatedly in the face be deductible?
Should be subsidized.
It depends. If you give money to a legal defense fund, you could argue that you’re hoping to buy a precedent in case you are ever similarly charged.
Fair enough. Charity could be seen as a voluntary insurance pool that would provide funds for those in difficult situations. Of course, that could be applied to other types of donations that are considered charity.
I definitely had some grey areas I had to dance around to write the article. Healthy adults I believe are harmed by handouts. The truly unfortunate are better served through charity than government programs, because charities do have to use there donations efficiently or no more donations. I have read that there is no such thing as altruism because you get something from giving, whether that be warm fuzzy feelings or the comfort in know if the other shoe drops, someone will help you.
Best summation ever
And only with 2 typos! Seriously, thanks to you and everyone for reading/participating.
I have read that there is no such thing as altruism because you get something from giving, whether that be warm fuzzy feelings
That argument has always bugged me. Feeling good because you did something compassionate does not disprove altruism.
We need to feel bad as we give money. It’s the religion of the state. Or Catholicism*.
*Joke because I know nothing of Catholicism.
Well, you should feel bad about that. Sit, stand, kneel, peace be with you. Confess and say some hail mary’s. You’ll be alright.
BTW, say them before you die, ’cause, if not, you’re screwed.
That’s the job of modern ethicists. Take something simple and make it needlessly complex.
“Feeling good because you did something compassionate does not disprove altruism.”
No, it defines it.
Incentives matter. I got where you were going with the article and figured it was our obligation as shitlords to poke at the edges of the argument.
I enjoyed reading the 9/11 stories from the comments this morning. I don’t have any memories of that day but I remember seeing a magazine cover sometime later that was disturbing to see.
I’m only 31, I shouldn’t feel that old, but now I do
You weren’t old enough to drink then. I polished off a bottle of whiskey and fumed in my tiny one room apartment. No internet. Had to watch NHK and had no idea what they were saying. Freaked me the fuck out.
I was in Jr high taking standardized tests. We weren’t allowed to watch live coverage because evidently 12 and 13 is too young to watch a seminal and tragic moment of our generation.
It doesn’t feel like it’s that long ago. Hard to believe it’s been almost twenty years. I still remember my girlfriend, now wife, meeting me coming out of the jet bridge on arrival a year or two before 9/11. There weren’t any boarding pass or id checks. Just go through the metal detector and X-ray machine. Anyone could walk around if they wished.
my tiny one room apartment
I knew it! You’re actually Don Lapre, faked your death and are now living in Japan to escape the Feds.
There are Feds here, too. They’re just a little more polite.
Speaking of polite, this is in my Amazon cart
https://www.amazon.co.jp/gp/product/4478102589/
It’s for English writing, but I cam across it on a English native speaker’s YouTube channel using it in reverse. From the snippets, it seems to have those great infuriating passive aggressive correspondence that leaves me with more questions than answers. I love those phrasing and wish to use it more myself.
Could use that myself. My emails are blunt AF.
・ I want to refuse to participate in an invited event
・ Large shipping delay due to fire. How do I contact you?
yeah, these two should handle all of my business correspondence needs.
Example: during a past stay I noticed my hotel reservation changed from one person to two person (with a corresponding rate change) and emailed the hotel. Their response
I think what it meant was that the actual rate charged would be the one person rate despite what it showed online for my reservation. I think. Nothing about why it changed which I asked about in my original email.
That is unintelligible. Whenever I go to a Tully’s (or similar places), the staff will try to flip over the menu to the English side. I just slap my hand on it before they can do it.
Or another, from a faq
Uses “in principle” which appears to be a qualifier, rather than a flat out “No”, but then states that it should be done within the timeframe after all. Makes more sense coming from a strict rules following culture I think, but for an American reading this, it’s seems slightly wish washy.
Modifier, not qualify.
I was 6 years old on 9/11. After reading the comments from this morning, I decided to ask my parents about what they remember from that day.
Before 9/11 I was in an uneasy relationship with my then-boyfriend. The relationship–or rather his attitude–drastically improved between September 10 and September 12. In other words, that’s my own private evidence of how 9/11 affected people.
I decided several years ago to not donate to charity until later in life. I rationalized that I was better off investing all the money I can to maximize my net worth. Then, if I decide to donate to charity at retirement age, I could donate more than if I donated on a regular basis.
Do it in your will, that way it’s painless and generous.
Good idea. I shouldn’t give up my money before I’m done using it.
I think there’s something lost when you don’t make it a habit. I know how to describe it from a spiritual point of view, but it’s hard to translate to secular.
I guess the least churchy way to put it is that by giving regularly, you affirm (to yourself and others) that you’re not the only person who matters in the world. This realization tends to multiply within you and result in more outrageous giving in the future.
That is an excellent summation, trashy.
Honest question. Is this video about picking up hookers?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAQSZhazYk8
No that’s about loving life and Quik-E-Marts and two-bit Michael Jacksons.
This is about picking up hookers.
We’re being unfair. Most 80’s stars dressed like pimps and hookers.
Here’s some charity for you over-nighters, I created a crossword and left a rambling, drunken submission but haven’t heard back from the TPTB. So for one night only if you click on my handle it will take you to my blog and you should see a button to launch said puzzle, the password is “Hyperion should change his handle”. I will most likely change the password in the morning so get it while the getting is good. the theme answers are a bit tortured (although clever as hell (my favorite is 27 down)) but I think I made most of the crosses easy enough that you should be able to finish it, especially once you grok the theme.
You bastards made Japanese lessons after I made them and then you make a crossword a week after I submit one. Not sure if I inspired these things or if you guys read my shit and think, “That sucks! I’ll show you how to do it!”
Why not both… I keed, I was inspired by your work.
Just don’t copy my next fucking project: A word search.
Please, I’m a crossword constructor now, word searches are beneath me.
It’s in the form of a CNN article.
Kinky (insert Hedy Lamarr GIF)
Damn – s’phisticated interface.
Yeah, I cannot figure out a way to enter text using my iPad.
Good stuff! I got about 75% complete and now I’m too tired to go on.
Scratch that – a burst of stubbornness and I’m down to two letters.
Heh.
DONE GODDAMMIT
WOOOT
PS. Good job, Hyp. Much enjoyed.
Well, so much for my reply to your email that I sent earlier tonight after I was done with MIL duty. *sigh*
(Sorry for the delay…OF ONLY 2 DAYS! But I’m currently the only one on the editorial team who is around at all.)
2 days! It seemed so much longer, and being my first ever crossword I was eager to share, tho it doesn’t look like many people checked it out and I’ve changed the password so If you still want to post it, It should be fresh to most glibs.
I have to say, I REALLY enjoy reading things like this. I disagree, but it makes me think hard about *why* I disagree.
Most people need a helping hand from time to time, and I’m ok with that.
One time I donated $20 to the red cross; one freaking time. I have probably received ~50 fundraising letters in the mail since that point. Assuming a cost of $1 per letter for materials and fulfillment, they squandered my donation and then some.
IIRC when I threw a small amount at GOA, I was encouraged to opt out of mailings if I didn’t want it so it would save them money. That’s the way to go!
After the Haiti disaster, I donated to Team Rubicon, and I still respect them based on what I see online. Not just for those they help, but for the wayward souls, i.e. veterans, that need a mission to anchor their soul. I have not donated much lately, but I elected to support Institute for Justice with my Amazon Smile purchases. (It’s like up to $30 …. yippiee)
I’m likely going to donate some to Code of Vets, what I see from that account on twitter is really moving for me.
I’m glad you enjoyed reading it. I too like to examine and challenge my own beliefs, which is why the SLD format appealed to me.
Seconded. My post below got too long and I snipped out my reaction to the article, which was visceral, then conflicted, then measured.
Charity is hard, and there are many ways to do it wrong.
snipped out my reaction to the article, which was visceral-
I can take it Trashy. The goal was to be a bit provocative, while trying to foment discussion. I did consider putting a disclaimer because I know there are commentators that have disabled family members or are facing hard times themselves, but I believe the people here are smart enough to recognize that I don’t mean any offense. Reading your list, you’re a saint. Thank you.
Thanks for that FM, I appreciate it. I think the initial emotional reaction I had was mostly intentional given that you wrote the article as an SLD, buf also because I just pulled the trigger on compassion international a few hours before reading the article, so I had the starkest of comparisons available in my mind. The pictures and profiles of the kids we sponsored are still sitting on my desk.
I say well done on this article! This is exactly what SLDs should be.
Regarding charity and efficiency, I sometimes think about the conditional giving that I do and wonder if I’m not positioning myself as an ubermensch. Who am I to set conditions on my graciousness? The answer I’ve settled on is if the conditions are in place to ensure the charity’s effectiveness, then fine. If they’re to conform the receiver to my image, then I’m suffering a bout of vanity.
I want to reiterate how much I like this article (autocorrect almost had me confessing my love of you here)
I’m going to be spending some time reading today’s earlier posts because I have not had a chance to yet. But for now, here’s a few 9/11 links that I enjoyed while chopping onions.
Twitter thread about search and rescue dogs:
https://twitter.com/ClaysandBirds/status/1171634962908553217?s=20
Video: “9/11: As Events Unfold”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EEogeIIOJzU
10/31/01: Lee Greenwood sings “God Bless the USA” at Yankee Stadium prior to Game 4 of the World Series between the D-backs and Yankees
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PvPgYLhOq24
Wait…if charity is banned, does that mean no more pity lays? I don’t think I can get behind that.
Good article, thanks.
I usually don’t go for the “unconditional benevolence” type of charity, but I did today. I practically never do anything they involves cash ending up in the hands of the target, because lack of money usually isn’t the root problem.
Here’s a list of groups I’ve worked with over the years and recommend:
Compassion International. Yeah, they’re Jesusy, but they give kids in various shit holes around the world food, education, and medical care. The only thing these kids have to do is accept Compassion’s help. Hmm, I wonder where they got that model from… Anyway, I was gonna make an orphan joke, but I was looking at the pictures of the kids my family sponsored today and I can’t bring myself to make a funny.
Habitat for Humanity. I wish I could get back involved with them, but time is short and it’s a bit of a haul from me to any job site. I’m a huge fan of H4H because the beneficiaries truly work for their house. Not only on their own house, but on others’ houses.
IJ. Enough said.
Special Olympics. Kids with Down Syndrome are a joy to spend time with.
St Jude. Enough said.
Good Samaritan Advocates. I hate doing pro bono work. It feels like I’m accorded respect and authority that I didn’t earn when I’m advicing some client in some area of law i have no exposure to. However, this is the best legal advice clinic I’ve worked at.
Salvation Army. I really want to get their disaster relief training and do some emergency deployments. Seems like a very impactful way to help out. Too bad I can’t just disappear from work for 2 weeks every time a hurricane comes.
There certainly is a strategic/pragmatic argument for charity like this. If the people don’t do it voluntarily, you’ll get pics of homeless children swaying the voters to elect a pol that will save the day. Ultimately it’s an argument against democracy.
Bookmarked some of those charities, obviously heard of most, but I like to keep a folder of charities in my bookmarks.
I just want more rare Poppy.
Pfft I used to have so much rare Poppy. Seems I deleted it all some time ago, must of felt it was getting creepy because I can’t find it anymore.
🙁
Yeah… it gone. Sorry mate.
Here ya go though, just for you my fren
https://imgur.com/cmjdmpF
No, really, that’s the saddest thing I’ve heard in a very long time.
However… I did rip some of her original covers off her Youtube before she deleted them and re-branded as the weirdo persona. There’s no way I would have deleted those, there’s gotta be a folder *somewhere*
For a while, you couldn’t find this on youtube, but I love it!
Poppy – Miike Snow – Animal cover
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GG9adNGXV4
OK, at least those aren’t lost.
I am also a fan of Habitat for Humanity.
I was too, until Alyssa Milano lost her mind.
I will leave that un-googled.
Anything particularly different come to mind when considering charity like legal funds for defense against injustice, specifically from the hand of govt?
For example, I was on the fence about donating to Count Dankula when he had to battle the UK law over his nazi pug video. Or maybe the Gen. Flynn guy (?) Countless other, better, examples but I’m running on fumes here.
The BBC Dankumentary
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ceeKZ5kNj_I
MacArthur stole our women.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t628QxjssUU
From a young age, I have felt sure that I will end up wealthy. So rather than worry about having enough money in the future, I worry about wasting too much time working instead of doing other things. If I die rich, I will have wasted my life.
My 10 year old asked us the other day, “Why are we poor?” She’s been comparing us to her friends’ parents. “Uh, we don’t have a mortgage any longer. Pay for our cars in cash. Trust me. We aren’t poor.” The other parents are mired in payments every month, but they have bigger houses and the newest model vehicles. Perspective is a helluva drug.
So you’re just a capitalist 1%er parasite eh?
1%? Nah. Unless you count all of human history.
I’m in my second year of grad school. I’m debt free and get paid to go. After spending the last year staying up late every night studying and working on homework assignments, I am ready to be done. I don’t want to spend another 3 years doing this to get a PhD. The additional pay I might get from having a PhD isn’t worth another 3 years of stress and no free time.
From a young age, I have felt sure that I will end up wealthy.
Guarantee it for yourself. Destroy your 401k contribution for the first years out of school. You’re used to living on nothing, so live on nothing plus just a little and dump $19k a year in + $6k a year in a Roth Ira for the rest of your 20s.
Once you get there, you can practically retire on that when you hit 62. Everything else pushes up your retirement date.
I’ve been mulling the idea of writing a personal finance post. Maybe I can motivate myself to actually do it.
Ok, for all you boomers that were hating on twitter the other day, I offer you this:
TW: 9/11 joke/humor
Read this tweet then read the top reply. God I love twitter sometimes.
https://twitter.com/TekJim/status/1171751953287827457
All right. That was funny.
TOO SOON
^That was funny.
“so let me get this straight, michigan adults who use flavored vapes to stop smoking literal TAR, are now not allowed to because some other people’s children, whom the product is ALREADY illegal for, were poorly parented.”
https://twitter.com/morganisawizard/status/1169346444056248321
Worse – it’s likely those children were smoking shit that’s not at all being targeted by this panic.
True.
I hope Trump is just talking out of his ass again. Because if they ban vape juice I’m going to be very upset.
Katherine Mangu-Ward
@kmanguward
My god. The intense stupidity of this logic:
1) Black market vape cartridges made people sick, so
2) let’s pass a bunch of regulations to push more popular types of vape cartridges into that same black market.
3) Lives will be saved!
Wait, no. THAT WON’T WORK AT ALL. Argh.
https://twitter.com/kmanguward/status/1171843560469086209
Hey, it works for gun control, right? RIGHT?
“Hillary Clinton leafs through her emails for nearly an hour at resolute desk in art exhibit”
https://thehill.com/blogs/in-the-know/in-the-know/461009-hillary-clinton-leafs-through-her-emails-for-nearly-an-hour-at
https://twitter.com/thehill/status/1171932214038335488
You can’t fool me. That’s from the Babylon Bee.
Hillary Clinton leafs through her emails for nearly an hour at resolute desk in art exhibit
© Francesco Urbano Ragazzi, Kenneth Goldsmith, Gerda Studio
Former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton spent nearly an hour leafing through some of her emails on display at an art exhibit in Italy.
In photos surfacing online, the former Democratic presidential nominee could be seen looking through stacks of some of her past emails, which came under scrutiny during the presidential campaign in 2016.
More than 60,000 pages of emails were printed out and assembled in large stacks on a mock presidential resolute desk for the exhibit, which was held at the Venetian Teatro Italia in Venice. The exhibit, titled “HILLARY: The Hillary Clinton Emails,” was created by artist Kenneth Goldsmith.
Francesco Urbano Ragazzi, who curated the show, said in a statement that Clinton visited the former movie theater for the exhibit Tuesday. Urbano Ragazzi said that Clinton sat down the exact replica of the resolute desk in the Oval Office, where she spent roughly an hour looking through her emails.
I’m sorry—what?
Is this to allude to a world where she’s convicted? If so, why? Or, is it to show that she left enough shit to fertilize the Sinai Peninsula, and allude to a world where she didn’t?
What you really have to appreciate is that she was only leafing through the stacks to see if there was anything classified that the museum/gallery (?) could be prosecuted for.
Turn-about IS fair play, and, old habits die hard.
Art is politics, and all that.
just curious afterthought: the display was meant to be touched, right? like, her quote implies there weren’t any velvet ropes or NE TOUCHE PAS, YA GABRONE signs, but I could see her walking in, having an aide unclip a velvet rope and hold it aside while she digs in for an hour.
9/11. It’s late, so few will see this. It was a day off, and the former wife was taking the kids to school on her way to work. I was making coffee. She came back in the house to tell me a plane had hit the WTC. I poured a cup of coffee, turned on the tv, and spent the day watching tragedy unfold. The first tower had already collapsed. I watched real time, as the second tower collapsed. Soon after, they were showing video of the aftermath, Everything, including the air, was gray. The audio sounded like crickets on a warm, summer evening. I immediately knew they were personal distress locators, and that every chirp represented a dead firefighter.
I have a tattoo on my right shoulder blade. It’s a 9/11 memorial, and the scroll on the front says, “Time passes, memory fades. But we will never forget.”
Under that is John 15:13, “No man has greater love than this, that he lay his life down for that of a brother”.
Beautiful man. Thank you.
My suggestion to the TPTB is they compile all these comments into another post for more convenient viewing, I don’t want to miss any of these stories.
Excellent point. I may incorporate that into my Saturday late night post, too. To provide more topics for discussion.
At BOS, 3 1/2 years ago.
https://imgur.com/a/TFLCA3g
All the BS that came in reaction to 9-11 (fuck the constitution, amirite?) has left me 18 years later still sad for the WTC victims, but not so much for the pentagon (the passengers excluded of course).
Oh, yeah–the Constitution of the US is great and all, but, well…I mean! We were attacked! And, we need to DO SOMETHING!!1!1ELEVENTY!
Having your nuts squeezed by nimrods at the airport was a bonus.
Pffft….you can get that done behind the airport for cheaper. So I’ve heard.
I had smart people tell me the same thing.
“We have to go to Iraq, kick Saddam’s ass, destroy those weapons of mass destruction”
I tried to caution them after experiencing the results on a personal level of the Gulf of Tonkin non-incident.
Ok to murder US citizen extrajudicially now. Trying to remember who it was that was killed, I see that the daughter was also killed two years ago, also by US forces.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nawar_al-Awlaki
If you’re on this *draws line in sand* side of the line, it’s fair game to drone strike you.
*prepares to turn on the shaker-table at straff’s signal*
Thanks Spud. On 9/11 I was living in a house in Oakland and attending UCB. I came down the stairs to hear the television on and my roommate watching it, which was very odd at 6am. “Look at this shit man, it’s all fucked up.” We watched the second plane hit in real time. There is no way to describe how terrible and surreal it was. We both sat there for several hours, drinking coffee and watching real life chaos and the world as we knew it changing in front of us. I knew we would be involved in prolonged war as a result.
Tonite, I was ruminating on the day and read up a few articles on it. One thing that stood out was something I mentioned in the weeks after. That no one in the government that should have known was going to face repercussions. All of those dead, innocent everyday people that should have been able to live their lives, gone. This was the single largest fuck up of our lives, and who should have known better? One guess as to who was the CIA station chief in Riyadh when it was planned and carried out.
There are still cover-ups. It’s unbelievable.
There was plenty of knowledge beforehand that something was up. And yet I don’t remember anyone getting fired or resigning as a result. There were massive intelligence, law enforcement and air defense fuck ups and yet I can’t find much of anyone being accountable for it. That station chief rose the ranks. He helped to cheerlead Iraq II and the abuses of surveillance and trampling of privacy. He had the balls to surveil congress members and then lie about it to them.
Bush flying all those Saudis out of the country right after the attacks gets forgotten.
Tin foil engaged!
FOIA engaged.
https://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php/September_11,_2001:_Evacuation_of_Saudi_Nationals
There was a great deal of shit that got brushed off and where real skepticism should have been we instead got the conspiracy bullshit that filled the void. I was an adult at that point, so I knew that what the media said was often bullshit, but that was the event that really opened my eyes to how bad it was. All of the questions that should have been asked were not. I can’t tell you how many hours I spent with people who thought it was all a set up. This was from various countries, because I left the US some months later for a few years. But not just foreigners, I had friends here who also thought it was an inside job.
I it had been an inside job it’d still be pending. And 5000% over budget. And scaled back to just one of the towers.
And end up taking out the Eiffel Tower by mistake.
It was a conspiracy. Just not the conspiracy the loose changers think it was.
Indeed. Those that should have been fired and in disgrace continued on or even rose in the ranks. I was infuriated at the time and still am. There were scant few voices that were calling attention to the real base of it. The wars helped with the distraction.
16 years later and another KIA in Iraq last month.
Who was the station chief? Brennan left in 99. Khobar Towers should have ended his career right there.
Yes, I was taking about Brennan. Actually, I got it a bit wrong. In 9/11 he was Deputy Executive Director of the CIA. He was station chief a couple years before during Khobar.
Fuck up from the ground up.
Promotions for everyone! The funding is about to go through the roof!
Pour encourager les autres Is just a historical footnote now.
Of course, even then
Prime Minister William Pitt the Elder was aware that the Admiralty was at least partly to blame for the loss at Minorca due to the poor manning and repair of the fleet. The Duke of Newcastle, the politician responsible, had by now joined the Prime Minister in an uneasy political coalition and this made it difficult for Pitt to contest the court martial verdict as strongly as he would have liked.
The severity of the penalty, combined with suspicion that the Admiralty had sought to protect themselves from public anger over the defeat by throwing all the blame on the admiral, led to a reaction in favour of Byng in both the Navy and the country, which had previously demanded retribution.
Indeed, GL.
I was not around for the thread and did not read all comments, but I think you underestimate mental illness, disability and the possibility of some homeless to improve their skills. Although it is true that many could.
My main issues with beggars is that a lot of them are pros / scam artists and you cannot really tell. There are beggars in Bucharest that earn more than the median wage begging. And they are good enough actors that it is hard to tell. Also, I support each mans right to be a bum, as long as he can find suckers to voluntarily fund his lifestyle.
Overall I would not support a ban on charity. If people want to give their money away, so be it. Charities that are grafts are, often these days, so because of various tax breaks for charity. If the income tax was 0, and there were no tax breaks for charity, a lot of that would solve itself.
While yes removing taxes, regulation etc would increase the job market and decrease the costs, this is a lost cause.
Also Charity is one of the better erotic masseuses and I support giving my money to Charity
That was good pie!
I think she spells it “C’haritee” though.
I think Q posted her picture above.
Otoh,Wendy four toes is real tired of”charity”, the strings don’t add up,
Charity is a dilemma for me too. I did take good advice years ago not to give that 50 cents or a buck at the checkout lane but rather to choose teeter than 5 charities , research them (Charity Navigator is a great resource) and give with a plan.
My favorite giving is doing stuff, like volunteering at church, donation of stuff to Goodwill, and other non cash things.
You mentioned some orgs and people you donate to a few days ago, correct?
Seriously. Time is something to be guarded jealously. It’s odd that people will cringe if someone asks for five bucks, but will waste so much of their time doing stupid stuff.
I have been totally warned off of “charities” here in Japan. After the triple-whammy disaster (earthquake, Tsunami, and nuke meltdown) 8 years ago there were collection boxes in lots of convenience stores all over – supposedly to help people who were left homeless, etc. I heard from a close friend who was translating between Japanese and US efforts that all that money went directly to the ruling political party.
Boy, we really did have some deep effects on them after WWII, huh?
Nah, in this case I would put this on them. Politics is rarely a clean business and the Japanese are pretty good at keeping it a paying proposition.
Yeah, I was just being snarky for snark’s sake.
It’s late, and the shift is kinda dragging
Yeah, this is the dead zone. I am on my rooftop watching the sun set here, grilling dinner for my family.
NOICE!
Aw, man! I missed the whole night shift!
No links yet? OK, random thought; Gals with lousy asses in tight jeans are the equivalent of me trying to impress a chick with my credit score.
Lynx up!!