Economics Corner with Paul Krugman and Winston’s Mom

She’ll be coming around the mounting when she comes…SHE”LL BE COMING AROUND THE MOUNTING WHEN SHE COMES….What?

 

Here’s today’s piece where he tries to go to town all over Lizzies butthole.

Not long ago, political pundits were writing off Elizabeth Warren’s political chances, but recent polling makes her an increasingly plausible contender, and her comeback has been getting her a sudden wave of favorable media coverage.

Will she actually be the Democratic nominee? If so, will she win? I have absolutely no idea. Nor does anyone else.

Oh sure. NOW you won’t make predictions professor limpdick…

But the political strategy powering her comeback is interesting. And I think many observers are missing a key reason her strategy seems to be working — namely, that her agenda is radical in content and implications, but well grounded in evidence and serious scholarship.

Normally, would-be presidential nominees campaign on some combination of personal narrative and soaring rhetoric promoting broad themes: “I’m a war hero/symbol of the American dream/longtime challenger of the Establishment, and as president I’ll bring us together/drain the swamp/fight the power.”

Warren, by contrast, has been rolling out substantive, detailed policy proposals — many, many substantive, detailed policy proposals. Traditional punditry says that this should be a turnoff, that voters’ eyes will just glaze over at the proliferation of white papers.

But Warren has managed to turn relentless wonkery into a defining aspect of her political persona. Supporters show up at her rallies wearing T-shirts that proclaim “Warren has a plan for that!” And she is, by all accounts, managing to make earnest policy discussion a way to connect with her audiences.

In a way, the closest parallel to the Warren phenomenon — although it’s one I hate to draw — was the temporary rise of Paul Ryan, former speaker of the House (remember him?). Like Warren, Ryan built himself up by cultivating an image as a smart policy wonk.

But even aside from the fact that Ryan’s basic agenda was to take from the poor and give to the rich, he was a phony, whose proposals didn’t add up and didn’t address real problems. Warren, by contrast, is the real deal. You don’t have to support the specifics of her plans to realize that they’re the product of hard thinking, drawing on the work of respected economic researchers.

I do remember him.  I also recall he failed to beat Joe Biden in a debate, when Joe’s argument was mostly to laugh at him.  He’s an establishment cuck, but predictably you don’t see the irony in your analogy.  Both are “policy wonks” because both think all they have to do is argue we must put them into power, and only then will they make everything all better.

In that case, however, why haven’t other presidential contenders been rolling out comparable plans? The answer, I’d suggest, is that Warren — herself a significant policy scholar — understood from the beginning something that other candidates are only beginning to grasp: The difference between being serious and being Serious.

What I mean by being Serious is buying into inside-the-Beltway conventional wisdom — the kind of conventional wisdom that in 2011, with unemployment still catastrophically high and interest rates at historic lows, created an elite consensus that we should stop worrying about jobs and focus on … entitlement reform. What I mean by being serious is paying attention to actual evidence on the effects of economic and social programs.

What Warren gets is that serious analysis is a lot more favorable to a progressive agenda than Serious conventional wisdom, which is obsessed with keeping taxes low and restraining spending. Leading experts on the economics of taxation favor substantial increases in tax rates on high incomes and wealth. Top economists studying social spending argue that there are huge benefits to higher spending on early child care.

As a result, Warren has been able to lay out plans that are very progressive but also well grounded in evidence and analysis.

Yes, the TOPPIEST of TOP.MEN economists want to steal from other people, tie them up in needless taxes and regulations, douse them all with warming lubricants to make it easier for them to mount on TOP of the people they just stole from and go STEVE SMITH on their asses!  That’s the type of TOP.MEN economists TOP.MEN like Krugnuts think are TOP.MEN.

Do her rivals share her understanding that progressivism and solid intellectual foundations can go hand in hand? In the past, at least, Joe Biden was worryingly Serious; he was deeply involved in the Obama administration’s fortunately unsuccessful attempt to negotiate a budget Grand Bargain that would have slashed Social Security and Medicare, reflecting the Beltway’s obsession with entitlement cuts. It’s not yet clear whether he has moved on.

Bernie Sanders, by contrast, has never bought into the Beltway consensus, and he is clearly committed to a very ambitious agenda. But his policy specifics remain oddly vague. Most notably, we still have very little idea how he would pay for Medicare for All.

My guess is that this is in part because Sanders sees himself as being in a war with the Establishment very broadly defined. As a result, his policy team, such as it is, consists of people who devote a lot of energy to attacking mainstream policy research, leaving them unable and/or unwilling to incorporate its findings into specific policy proposals.

Now, none of this means that Warren will be the nominee. Many Democratic voters clearly prefer Biden’s affable conventionality, and many others share Sanders’s tear-the-whole-thing-down instincts. All we really know is that there turns out to be a significant constituency most pundits probably didn’t even realize was there: voters who want a significant policy move to the left, but also want a candidate who really seems to have thought things through.

We don’t yet know whether this constituency is big enough to be decisive in the Democratic primaries. But if it is, Warren has a plan for that.

The fun part about all of these plans that Lizzie is putting out for people like Krugman to beat his meat over, is that Lizzie is running for president.  The president doesn’t have the Constitutional power to implement nearly any of these plans, that power lies with Congress.  Lizzie is presently a Senator, one would think if she has all of these plans she would be better able to put these into action in the senate.  Why hasn’t she?  Here’s an Atlantic article from 2015 that questions her abilities as a Senator, and makes a case that she’s effective in her ineffectiveness.  Here’s another from Boston Globe from 2017 that describes her accomplishments as “emaciatingly thin”.  For somebody that wants to lecture us on the difference between a serious candidate and a Serious candidate, one would think you could at least find one that actually succeeded or at least appears to be successful in their present position.

Then again, you’re an night clerk at shit-covered Motel 6 in Newark having trouble fluffing a hobo, that got a column masquerading as an economist. So how the hell would you know the difference?

Comments

221 responses to “Economics Corner with Paul Krugman and Winston’s Mom”

  1. Left Hand of Radar

    Can I get a first? Specifically from Winston’s Mom?

    1. leon

      That ship sailed long ago… unless it’s your first

      1. Left Hand of Radar

        Just hoping for her “first” of the day.

        1. ChipsnSalsa

          You’re hilarious, you would be on the second hand if counting separate individuals.

          1. Festus

            He’s waiting on that sweet ass-slapping GIF (as are we all).

          2. Chafed

            So say we all.

          3. BakedPenguin

            No one? Here.

        2. Pope Jimbo

          She’d have to stop for there to be another first

  2. The Other Kevin

    “Do her rivals share her understanding that progressivism and solid intellectual foundations can go hand in hand? ”

    [Citation needed]

    1. Scruffy Nerfherder

      Solid intellectual foundations means fancy sounding gobbledygook.

    2. R C Dean

      See, and here I thought “progressivism” and “solid intellectual” anything were pretty much incompatible.

    3. leon

      As long as you accept the premises of the left, the foundations are solid

      1. wdalasio

        As long as you accept the premises of the left, at this particular moment, the foundations are solid

    4. grrizzly

      Warren is an intellectually dishonest hack. She compared apples to oranges to get to her conclusion that most bankruptcies were driven by high health care costs.

  3. Scruffy Nerfherder

    “reflecting the Beltway’s obsession with entitlement cuts. ”

    Say what now?

    1. leon

      I’m becoming more convinced that Krugman lives in a universe where the only news comes from Democratic Underground. See the latest contra Krugman where he is appalled that the right calls the leftists socialists. Imagine the uproar if leftists called the right a party of Facsists (he seriously said that) he then spends the rest of the column explaining why the Republicans are fascists.

      1. Raven Nation

        It’s kind of sad, given how solid his early work was – when he was just being an economist and not going all in on being an opinion writer.

        1. wdalasio

          when he was just being an economist

          Wait, you mean that’s the same Paul Krugman?!

          1. ChipsnSalsa

            Mr. Lizard’s group may have made some “adjustments”.

          2. Nephilium

            See, and there’s a hook for someone to remake (again) Invasion of the Body Snatchers.

        2. Ozymandias

          It may only be a blog and a few articles, but people who make their living as economists called bullshit on Krugman way back when, right after he got his Nobel in 2008 for work that some claim had already been done.

          I hope these links work because that is a shit-ton of href and brackets.

          1. Ozymandias

            The last link is to a Cafe Hayek piece by Russ Roberts and since I SF’d the last link, I’m pasting it here.
            https://cafehayek.com/2008/10/krugmans-prize.html

      2. Scruffy Nerfherder

        You know, there’s bullshit and then there’s complete denial of reality.

        I can only hope he’s just a cynical piece of shit, because the alternative is kind of frightening.

      3. The Other Kevin

        At this point it’s just “Republicans bad, Democrats good” written with fancy words.

        1. AlexinCT

          ^^^^THIS^^^^

          RESIST TRUMP-PUTIN-HITLER!

          Yeeeaaaahhrgggg!

          1. R C Dean

            “solid intellectual foundation”

            “really thought things through”

    2. Chafed

      The last time that happened was during the Clinton administration. I’m not a world famous economist or NYT columnist but I seem to remember Bush, Part 2, passing Medicare Part D into law and Obama loosening requirements for all sorts of means tested programs.

  4. leon

    “But Warren has managed to turn relentless wonkery into a defining aspect of her political persona. Supporters show up at her rallies wearing T-shirts that proclaim “Warren has a plan for that!”

    You know who else had a plan…?

    1. Timeloose

      By the way, she is proof that any idiot can make a plan.

    2. ChipsnSalsa

      Ross Perot?

    3. Nephilium

      But is it a five year plan?

      1. Chipwooder

        Not sure, but I hear her plan would constitute something of a great leap forward.

        1. AlexinCT

          And she intends to do produce a bigger body count than Stalin and Mao combined?

    4. Chipwooder

      Generalfeldmarschall von Schlieffen?

      1. BakedPenguin

        No, that one almost achieved its’ goal.

    5. MikeS

      The Brain?

      1. Sean

        NARF!

  5. wdalasio

    Elizabeth Warren: She has a Five Year Plan for that!

    1. Nephilium

      Damn you man! DAMN YOU!

      /shakes fist

      1. TARDIS

        HA-HA!

        /Nelson

  6. leon

    ““But Warren has managed to turn relentless wonkery into a defining aspect of her political persona. Supporters show up at her rallies wearing T-shirts that proclaim “Warren has a plan for that!”

    But does her plan include any ultimate solutions?

    1. wdalasio

      Give’em enough time, leon, and they always arrive at a Final Solution.

    2. Chafed

      And her supporters haven’t read any of them.

  7. leon

    “But Warren has managed to turn relentless wonkery into a defining aspect of her political persona. Supporters show up at her rallies wearing T-shirts that proclaim “Warren has a plan for that!”

    You know who else’s supporters coordinated their apparel?

    1. Scruffy Nerfherder

      N’Sync’s?

    2. ChipsnSalsa

      Insane Clown Posse?

      1. Festus

        Kiss Army?

  8. leon

    “significant constituency most pundits probably didn’t even realize was there: voters who want a significant policy move to the left, but also want a candidate who really seems to have thought things through”

    Unfortunately it appears that no one has stepped forward to fill that role

    1. R C Dean

      As with “progressivism” and “solid intellectual foundation”, “significant policy move to the left” and “really thought things through” seem mutually exclusive.

  9. Timeloose

    “In a way, the closest parallel to the Warren phenomenon — although it’s one I hate to draw — was the temporary rise of Paul Ryan, former speaker of the House (remember him?). Like Warren, Ryan built himself up by cultivating an image as a smart policy wonk.”

    I don’t remember Ryan as the policy wonk in that election, but compared to Trump they were all Gingrich.

    1. R C Dean

      Probably a callback to the meeting where Ryan wanted to go all wonky with Obama on OCare, and Obama just shut him down. What an embarrassment.

    2. CPRM

      Ryan was gonna Throw Momma From The Train throw granny off a cliff with his entitlement reform.

        1. Festus

          Sorry to hear about your troubles, CPRM. Familial relationships are a conundrum at the best of times. That situation must have been terrible. Best thoughts coming your way, Friend.

          1. CPRM

            Thanks.

  10. Festus

    “Bitchy Librarian 2020”

  11. ChipsnSalsa

    Liz’s picture if you click through to the Times site…

    “Are you not entertained?!?”

    but without the emotion.

    1. Festus

      “Imma go get me a beer!” and then proceeds to drink it like she’s never graduated from a sippy-cup. So relatable, she’s just like us!

      1. Rhywun

        She thinks she’s people!

        1. Festus

          Awesome!

        2. Technically correct. At least 2 people at this point. Maybe more by the time I finish episode 2.

  12. mikey

    First World Problems Thursday.
    Yesterday iI’m working in the backyard and the wife comes outside and finds me swearing up a storm. “What’s wrong?” Uttered in her “He’s off again” voice. I’m trying to put gas in the power washer with one of those new “SAFTEY” gas cans. Even with her helping to steady the washer it’s impossible. I appropriate a funnel from the kichen and manage both fill the washer tank and spilll a couplle cups of gas on the patio. “Water jug” replacement spouts are on order from Amazon.

    So, then I put the mountain bike on the car rack and take it to bike shop in town to investigate the funny noise it’s making. Of course, the bike refuses to make a sound at the shop. When I get home the rear tire is flat. WTF? This morning I fill the tire with air, dunk it in water and find nothing. Couple hours later the air pressure is still good. Im thinking some ahole let the air out while I was in the Safeway.

    Well, it’s a gorgeous day so I’ll think I’ll go for a bike ride in the mountains. I make sure I’ve got my tire fixing stuff and the pump.

    1. STEVE SMITH ALSO RIDE IN THE MOUNTAINS. AND THE FOREST. AND THE PLAINS.

      1. mikey

        I never leave home without my trusty can of bear spray.

        That should work.
        Shouldn’t it?

        1. ChipsnSalsa

          BEAR SPRAY LIKE TOILET WATER FOR STEVE SMITH!

          1. mikey

            Wife has actually suggested I start carrying.

          2. mindyourbusiness

            That’s an old American Standard…

    2. Festus

      Mikey, earlier today – https://youtu.be/wWYFxekoAsM

    3. Nephilium

      Enjoy your ride man.

    4. ChipsnSalsa

      Well, it’s a gorgeous day so I’ll think I’ll go for a bike ride in the mountains

      Always a good course of action.

      What is the funny noise?

      1. mikey

        Operator error I suspect.
        Washed a couple rides-worth of mud off and then didn’t take a test ride afterwards. There was a ton of shit between the bash plate and the bottom bracket.

        1. Festus

          So long as it’s not the crank bearings. I hated when that happened.

        2. ChipsnSalsa

          Right, that can pack up nicely if things get moist. Good cleaning can work wonders.

          Like changing your filter, remember to lube your chain kids.

  13. A Gramma-School-Marm “policy wonk” presidency is not possible in The Best Timeline ™ timeline. We demand Trump-levels of entertainment!

    If it does happen, it will be mighty boring with a likely Republican House and/or Senate stopping all of her “master plans”.

    1. Actually I think if the Dems do get all levers of power – the house, senate, and WH – they are going to go full-throttle. For example: Obamacare was really half-hearted compared to what they could have done. Next time it’s going to be single-payer. And pass the anti-gun laws. And reparations.

      Sure they might pay for it next time in the ballot box – but we know how good Republicans are at rolling the behemoth back.

      1. Festus

        Balls to the wall. They’re not even pretending anymore.

        1. Add in the weaponized bureaucracy and the cohort of friendly lefty judges, there’s nothing stopping ’em. Trump is just the last (and failed) gasp against The Swamp. Maybe the Supreme Court will slap down a few of the worst things but given cretins like Roberts, I would be surprised. And add in the court packing plan, it would only be a small bump in the road.

          Or maybe I’m just being cynical.

          1. Festus

            As I get older I’ve found my cynicism to be a warm, cozy bed that I’m loathe to rise from on a chilly winter’s morn…

    2. R C Dean

      it will be mighty boring with a likely Republican House and/or Senate stopping all of her “master plans”.

      Such the optimist you are. I would bet the Repubs default back to bipartisan cucking.

      Trump is just the last (and failed) gasp against The Swamp.

      Even though their coup attempt failed, I think their power is completely undiminished. Their pet judges will continue to ensure that no meaningful change can be made to rein in the administrative state. I see no possibility that even a Republican-controlled Congress would pass the kind of laws needed to even make reform of the administrative state and the judiciary possible.

      As with the Culture Wars, its over. Nothing left but shooting survivors, and the eventual collapse of the whole unsustainable edifice.

      1. The administrative and economic wars were lost before Oswald’s hunk of lead finished its fateful trip. LBJ was the final nail in that coffin.

        The culture war was the last hot theater, and there some funny guy up on the balcony next to the president. It’s time for the cultural equivalent of Reconstruction. Hold on tight, because STEVE SMITH is an amateur compared to these baboons!

  14. Hyperion

    “Yes, the TOPPIEST of TOP.MEN economists”

    History seems to have this uncanny way of repeating itself, despite the best efforts of some to erase it and make it go away.

    These self proclaimed TIPPY TOPPIES (thanks, Gulag Barbie), seem to also be among the toppiest in forgetting the lessons of history.

    so eager they are, to become the propaganda arm to help usher in the new Bolshevik revolution (totes different that the last one, you know, because the right TIPPIEST TOPPIEST), forget some key history lessons. Once the new Soviet utopia has been ushered in and the new comrade numero uno has taken command, TIPPY TOPPY guys have no more use. There is no need for a Economist Czar when there is no one left to convince. Comrade numero uno need not convince anyone. You either get convinced, or it is off to the gulags with you. Which is why TIPPY TOPPY Economy guy is one of the first to be lined up against the wall, with the most shocked look on his face. /THE END

    1. Yep – if you have total control, who needs wonks? Instead the positions of power are filled with weak yes men.

      1. leon

        :New Vegas Intensifies:

      2. MikeS

        You know who else filled positions of power with yes men?

        1. Raven Nation

          Chris Squire?

  15. LJW

    Over 400,000 Facebook users pledge Area 51 raid: ‘Lets see them aliens’

    Has this been posted. If so, sorry been single dadding it this week haven’t had much time on the site.

    1. Fatty Bolger

      Let me see ’em alien titties.

      1. DrOtto

        +3 Total Recall

    2. Hyperion

      Facebook, the only place where 400,000 imbeciles can congregate at the same time. Well, OK, there is Twitter…

      1. R C Dean

        Speaking of which, what’s the web traffic here looking like?

        1. Not Adahn

          Just one IP address. In Russia.

          1. Hyperion

            THERE IS ONLY ONE TULPA BOT.

    3. MikeS

      been single dadding it this week haven’t had much time on the site.

      You need to check your priorities.

      1. Hyperion

        Yeah, shouldn’t a good Glib lock the rugrats up in the broom closet and get to shit posting?

  16. Fatty Bolger

    Speaking of Paul Ryan: Donald Trump slams Paul Ryan in late-night Twitter rant: ‘Couldn’t get him out of Congress fast enough!’

    In Alberta’s book, Ryan also characterized Trump as uneducated about the government: “I told myself I gotta have a relationship with this guy to help him get his mind right,” Ryan said, according to The Washington Post. “Because I’m telling you, he didn’t know anything about government. … I wanted to scold him all the time.”

    I guess they think that makes Trump look bad? I’d say it’s an inadvertent compliment.

    An excerpt of the book also details how Ryan wanted to excommunicate Trump after the “Access Hollywood” tape was released during the campaign.

    “This is fatal,” he told Reince Priebus, then chairman of the Republican National Committee. “How can you get him out of the race?”

    Real political genius, that Ryan.

    1. mikey

      “I guess they think that makes Trump look bad? I’d say it’s an inadvertent compliment.”
      Yep. Throughout history royal courts have had elaborate speech and behavior codes to help keep outsiders away. Modern Washinton in no different from any royal court.

    2. Festus

      *Insert gif of Paul Ryan desultorily fapping into his special “Presidential Ambitions” sock*

    3. Hyperion

      Eddie Munster was never anything more than the new hopeful to become the establishment poster boy. Don’t let the door hit you, Munster.

      1. ChipsnSalsa

        He had so many concession speeches already written, he had to start a database to keep track of them.

        1. Festus

          “Tremble and quail before the power of my Widow’s Peak for I am the Future of the Republican Party!”

        2. Hyperion

          I can just see Ryan and Rubio as apiring young high schoolers dressed in their best preppy, off to attend the next meeting of the Young Republicans, real life Alex P. Keatons, visions of being the new wonder establishment boys in the next BOOSH admin. Then, suddenly, just as they were about to realize their dreams, out of nowhere comes ORANGEBADMAN and crushes their hopes forever! BWAHHAHAAAAHHHAA!

          1. Festus

            Usurper! Those two represent the worst instincts of the Republican Party, always quick with an apology and handy at conceding the high ground to a lesser foe. I say this as a disinterested non-citizen, certainly not a right-winger in anything but a yen for some push-back against the growing insanity of the Dems.

          2. Fourscore

            I’m picturing Ryan/Rubio on one side of the gym, AOC and Omar on the the other. “You go first, Marco, ask the girl on the left (Omar) to dance”

            “No, Tim, you get her, I’m a Latino and so is the other one, that’s the one I want. Let’s go over together”

            On the other side of the gym, “I’m hoping the short guy asks me, he looks cute”, says AOC.

            “Sure, leave me with the geeky looking guy, everyone will be laughing at me”

            Stall long enough, the music stops and everyone is rescued.

    4. R C Dean

      This is fatal

      Nice of you to go on record with a completely wrong political call, Paul.

      Ryan was a NeverTrumper. Nothing was more important to him that Trump failing. Even throwing away the rare opportunity of controlling both houses of Congress was worth it to hamstring Trump.

    1. Festus

      “Ahem!” Gaze upon the avatar directly above.

    2. Pope Jimbo

      Uffda. I can’t please you people. Do you want the animated avatar to come back?

  17. R C Dean

    Well, that didn’t take long. Nike is coming to AZ after all.

    No word on whether Ducey rescinded his withdrawal of the $1mm grant, but

    Under its agreement with [the town of] Goodyear, [AZ] Nike is to receive $2 million in incentives if it meets certain thresholds.

    1. Fatty Bolger

      Somebody explained to the governor that not getting that Nike plant could be… unlucky for him.

      1. ChipsnSalsa

        Put a “Betsy Ross” flag on just about anything and it’s gonna move for the next six months.

        1. MikeS

          You don’t say?

          *calls tattoo parlor to get a Betsy Ross flag tattoo on my dick*

          1. Festus

            Circumular or linear?

          2. MikeS

            I think circumular would be the classiest.

    2. Raston Bot

      the town of Goodyear is paying them $2M but did Ducey still pull the state’s $1M grant?

      1. R C Dean

        No word on whether Ducey rescinded his withdrawal of the $1mm grant

    1. MikeS

      “‘She’ does not represent a gender. She is not just a woman. ‘She’ doesn’t refer to a vagina. She is a force of nature. She is power. She can be anything you want to be, therefore, she is everything,” she says of her LP’s title. “She is the super she. She is the she-ro. She is the She-E-O.”

      Much woke. Many brave.

      1. Scruffy Nerfherder

        “She” is full of shit.

        1. Festus

          Sure, and that makes me the new Transformers character, JANI-TOR.

  18. AlexinCT

    For those that saw this headline: Study: A Daily Dose Of Nuts Could Be Key To Staying Sharp In Old Age and thought this is gonna make my woman put out, I am gonna let you know it is all a fucking racket by the Planters dude.

    1. MikeS

      You mean that guy in the top-hat and monocle? I’m on board.

    2. The Other Kevin

      I heard that Planter’s guy has a secret orgy bowl where he frolics with underage cashews.

      1. Pope Jimbo

        Nope he is totes into golden showers. Yup. Really gets off on pee nuts.

    3. Festus

      Mr. Peanut be pimpin, Yo!

    4. ChipsnSalsa

      That’s why Winston’s mom does so well on these articles.

    5. Hyperion

      *Waits for study to be published next week concluding that ”A daily dose of nuts can lead to mental decline in old age*

      The Planter’s dude can actually spread all the propaganda he wants, there’s no downside. COI is meaningless in that regard. Yes it has to be disclosed. So? Won’t stop me from continuing the study, publishing my conclusions and sending it off to the nearest hack journalist to create a sensationalist headline with. Science is dead, man, the new dark ages are upon us.

  19. “Tulsi Gabbard Apologist”

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/nypd-investigating-megan-rapinoe-posters-vandalized-with-homophobic-slurs-as-hate-crime/ar-AAE8C3h

    If speech was being criminalized and none of the so-called “free speech absolutists” (lol) sued to oppose it, do you still have a First Amendment?

    1. Hyperion

      Another case of pulling a Jussie?

      1. “Tulsi Gabbard Apologist”

        Another case of someone being charged with blasphemy. Don’t be surprised if ten years from now we are talking about people being charged with “hate crimes” for misgendering someone.

        This is how hate crime laws are inevitably going to come to America. Couple this with the numerous articles and incidences (from Iowa, to Nebraska, to New York) where people who have burned LGBT flags (even those that they own) were charged with “hate crimes”. If you burn an American flag you can be charged with petty theft (if you stole it from someone) and possibly arson, but that’s it because burning a flag is speech. But, if burning a flag is speech then charging someone with a “hate crime” for burning a flag is inherently a hate speech law.

        The Supreme Court ruled in 2000 that you cannot be charged with a “hate crime” for burning a cross, but somehow I doubt that anyone nowadays would take up a case like this so the speech codes will just exist on the local level while theoretically being unconstitutional

        1. “Tulsi Gabbard Apologist”

          *hate speech laws*

        2. Hyperion

          Hate speech laws would effectively be the end of free speech. Which is why leftist love the idea so much. Just like they love ‘common sense’ gun control, which is effectively the end of the 2nd. Get rid of both and you get your utopia.

          1. This reminds me of the whole “The first amendment refers specifically to political speech, not just any speech” argument that I believe the socons were making several years ago. Now it’s “Hate speech isn’t free speech”. It’s the same crock of shit. The language of the amendment couldn’t be any clearer.

          2. Nephilium

            In the next draft, it’ll have an addendum:

            “And this time… we mean it!”

        3. Scruffy Nerfherder

          I fully expect Roberts to cave on this issue.

        4. R C Dean

          Well, you can somehow charge somebody with a hate crime for burning a gay pride flag, but not a US flag, even though both sexual orientation and national origin are protected classes.

          Of course, the hate crime is only supposed to be a sentence enhancer for some other crime – theft, arson, whatever. In this case, they have vandalism. We aren’t quite to “hate speech is a crime” yet, but the technical distinction is getting ground away and the idea of prosecuting people for hate speech is getting normalized.

          Yes, Roberts is easily capable of barfing up some jurisprudential word salad to allow this to go forward.

          1. “Tulsi Gabbard Apologist”

            Burning a flag is speech. You cannot technically charge someone with a hate crime for burning an American flag. And I don’t know of any incident where that has occurred.

            You guys keep thinking Roberts will choke and allow this. You’re thinking too far ahead. This will never even reach Roberts. Most of these challenges to speech restrictions are brought by supposed free speech groups. Those groups completely choked on defending a baker (religious liberty groups had to defend him)- there is no way that any of them will ever defend this. Cocktail parties are on the line, which means that’s the point where the liberal always folds like a house of cards.

          2. “Tulsi Gabbard Apologist”

            Liberalism and its adherents are increasingly being exposed as a sham

          3. Are we talking “liberalism” as in DemProgSocLeftism, or supposed classical liberalism that is really just either neowarmongerism or woketarianism?

            I can’t keep up.

            I have one label that encompasses them all; slavers.

          4. R C Dean

            Burning a flag is speech. You cannot technically charge someone with a hate crime for burning an American flag.

            But you can for burning a gay pride flag. Some animals are more equal that others, I guess.

        5. Rhywun

          Don’t be surprised if ten years from now we are talking about people being charged with “hate crimes” for misgendering someone.

          This was already proposed in NYC – don’t know if it went anywhere.

          1. “Tulsi Gabbard Apologist”

            A lot of those laws were passed on local levels, but from my understanding they are purposely not being enforced (for now). They’ll wait to enforce them, hoping that the legal ground will shift allowing them free reign in the future to impose blasphemy laws

          2. R C Dean

            + 1 sharia

    2. Raston Bot

      crazy homeless black dude.

  20. PieInTheSky

    So I bought a 100 lei wine bottle and the store gave me a crappy bag which broke on the way home and with it the bottle. I am pissed. I will never buy from that store again.

    1. ChipsnSalsa

      Out like 10 cents then?

    2. PieInTheSky

      I am pissed in both the British and American sense of the word

    3. grrizzly

      As a little kid, I saw my grandpa drop a bottle of vodka he had just bought in a store. He was very disappointed.

      1. When something like that happens in Russia, don’t you just walk out into the frozen taiga and never return?

  21. On Topic:

    https://www.thecollegefix.com/sugar-daddy-business-thrives-as-more-coeds-sign-up-to-pay-off-student-debt/

    “Rather than look to Washington for relief, more than two million students are turning to Sugar Daddies and Sugar Mommies”

    How DARE they leverage the ability to make money in voluntary transactions instead of asking the biggest Sugar Daddy of all for a bailout!

    1. R C Dean

      How desperate would a cougar have to be to pay some feminized college gamma male for sex?

      1. I’m 40 but I’m aging well, ladies…

    2. PieInTheSky

      “Anna and many other sugar babies said sex is expected by a majority of men on the site,” according to the Daily Tar Heel article. – that is all so very strange. I would have thought their conversation skills would suffice

      1. AlexinCT

        Yeah. Let me give you a ton of money for…….

    3. Scruffy Nerfherder

      I just need more money and less family.

    4. Fatty Bolger

      President Donald Trump’s administration is partly responsible for a new wave of college students seeking out “sugar daddies”

      Trump and/or climate change are the explanation for about 99% of all bad stuff happening in the world.

      1. Scruffy Nerfherder

        Say what now? Trump is responsible in what way?

        1. Fatty Bolger

          Every way. Don’t you watch the news?

      2. Pope Jimbo

        Since Trump is pretty much responsible for 100% of climate change, I say give him all the credit.

        1. So if I start going on “compensated dates” with these young ladies, I guess I have one more think to be thankful to Trump for!

    5. The Other Kevin

      “Often times, these relationships are expected to be sexual, some of its users have said.”
      SHOCKING!

      1. well if I’m forking out a few thousand (or tens of thousands) of dollars, I would hope so.

        1. AlexinCT

          For that kind of money I better get to woodpecker them…

          1. I don’t know what that means, but I’m envisioning some sort of beak dildo and one of those reciprocating saw dildoes.

  22. Fatty Bolger

    Father chases down thief who stole car with children inside and beats him to death with help of bystanders

    A father chased down and beat to death a thief who stole a car with his children inside, US police have said.

    Bystanders also joined in the attack on the 54-year-old man, who later died in hospital of head injuries, said detectives in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania.

    Three young children – aged seven months, 18 months, and five years old – were in the Hyundai when the carjacker stole it on Thursday evening.

    Their mother had left the car running as she went into a pizza takeaway where her boyfriend – who is the father of the two younger children – was working at 9pm local time.

    As the woman was speaking to her partner, the thief climbed into the car and drove off.

    The parents, both aged 25, ran after the car, which became stuck in traffic nearby.

    “They were able to pull this car thief out of the vehicle,” chief inspector Scott Small, of the Philadelphia Police Department, told local television station WPVI.

    “He fled on foot about a half a block. And the boyfriend caught up to him and there was some sort of physical struggle that ensued,” Mr Small said.

    “Then other males from the neighbourhood intervened and began punching and kicking the male who took the vehicle.”

    The man was taken to hospital with severe head and facial injuries. He was pronounced dead at 10.05pm local time.

    1. leon

      I wouldn’t convict

      1. R C Dean

        I’d struggle, but running down a fleeing criminal and beating him to death post facto isn’t really self-defense.

        1. AlexinCT

          Kids in the car…

          1. Scruffy Nerfherder

            That’s all I would need to justify it.

          2. tarran

            But he was beaten to death after he abandoned the car and fled on foot leaving the children behind.

            A punitive beat-down that results in death is murder. This doesn’t sound like the involuntarily killing of someone while stopping a crime that is putting innocent people in danger of life or serious injury (which stealing a car full of someone else’s children unquestionably is). It sounds more like vengeance.

          3. Mad Scientist

            The thing is, several bystanders beat him too. They’ll never prove to a jury that the father dealt the blow that killed the guy.

          4. R C Dean

            That’s a complication, but that’s also what felony murder statutes are for. They all participated in a felony (aggravated assault) and the victim died. They can all go down for felony murder.

          5. Scruffy Nerfherder

            I still wouldn’t vote to convict him.

          6. R C Dean

            Trust me, I get it, but once he’s fleeing he’s no longer posing an imminent risk of death or serious injury. Tackle and hold him for the cops, sure. Beat him to death? Not really self-defense at that point. If we don’t think cops should be allowed to gun down fleeing suspects, then we can’t say crime victims or bystanders should be allowed to kill them, either.

        2. Pope Jimbo

          Here is my guess. He’ll cop a plea for some minor assault and get some probation time (no jail time). The DA will sell it by telling him that if he doesn’t accept it, he will bring charges against his wife for leaving the kids in the car and also get Child Welfare involved.

    2. Pope Jimbo

      How much of a nut punch will it be when the kids are all in foster care because Dad is in jail for manslaughter and Mom is in jail for leaving her kids in the car unattended.

    3. The world is just a little bit better place now.

  23. R C Dean

    Trump is now white-knighting for Pelosi, saying she isn’t a racist.

    “I think [Ocasio] Cortez is being very disrespectful to somebody who’s been there a long time. I deal with Nancy Pelosi a lot and we go back and forth and it’s fine, but I think that a group of people is being very disrespectful to her and you know what, I don’t think that Nancy can let that go on,” Trump said before departing the White House on Friday. “She is not a racist.”

    That’s gotta have Nancy grinding her dentures.

    1. THIS is the kind of political apocalypse I was hoping would happen when Trump got elected, but it’s not at all what I imagined. I’m running out of popcorn.

      1. Raston Bot

        i was expecting a gay vs muslim intraparty war. the leftists vs moderates is kind of weak compared to the trans vs feminists scraps that are heating up.

        1. IMO, that stuff got postponed becuz ORANGEMANBAD. They have a common enemy for the moment. Once that goes away, they’ll start destroying each other with gusto.

    2. Fatty Bolger

      LOL! That’s how you do it.

    3. ChipsnSalsa

      I don’t think that Nancy can let that go on

      Challenge laid out, what kind of leader are you Nancy? You gonna take that from some freshman?

      1. R C Dean

        Seriously.

        Sandy was bitching about being on so many committees. She’s too stupid to realize that’s where the real work is done, and where the real power is exercised. So give her what she wants: take her off every committee. Why not? Its not like she’s doing anything anyway.

        1. BakedPenguin

          She has a similar problem as Trump: the in-your-face posturing which made her popular to voters makes her something of a pariah to her peers.

          And yes, she is woefully naive (and possibly really stupid, too) about the actual workings of the government.

          1. Mad Scientist

            We’re well beyond possibly. She is Hank Johnson level stupid.

          2. BakedPenguin

            Yeah. Guam’s gonna tip over because of global warming, not because of overpopulation.

          3. R C Dean

            I quit giving her the benefit of the doubt on being naive instead of really stupid. She’s just not very fucking smart. Like a lot of people who get a big lucky break, she thinks she deserves it.

          4. Pope Jimbo

            Her entire knowledge of legislating comes from watching Schoolhouse Rock.

            As a zealot, she also doesn’t have the capacity to understand that horsetrading is a necessary evil if you want to pass a law. She thinks she can frame it as a black and white issue and everyone will be forced to vote for it.

          5. tarran

            The thing about Trump is that he is quite happy to announce that he made a mistake and change course.

            AOC, OTOH, presents herself as someone who knows it all and thus should be in charge. As a result she can’t just say, “Oh, I messed up!”. Because that would falsify the rationale that impels her supporters to follow her.

            She isn’t allowed to be humble, because her followers confuse humility with stupidity and arrogance with wisdom. She is doomed to forever exercise the sort of hubris that leads to massive destruction. Hopefully between now and her inevitable fall she doesn’t amass any power to do much harm.

    4. Sean

      How can you not like this guy? The entertainment factor is off the charts.

    5. The Other Kevin

      I have seen several of you write this, but you have me on board now.

      Best. Timeline. Ever.

      1. BakedPenguin

        Second.

    6. Master Troll indeed.

      1. Pope Jimbo

        Only if he later tweets out how much he likes AOC and her concern for the immigrants. “AOC and I both love immigrants and want to do something for the people stuck on the border. But Old Nancy won’t move on any legislation”

        1. Stinky Wizzleteats

          Give it a week…

  24. Pope Jimbo

    Yeah, last time the MSM lectured us all on how lucky we were to be able to vote for a harpy because she was so smart and qualified (WITH VAGINA) it worked out so well, why not try it again?

    If I was one of the minorities on the Dem plantation a Warren candidacy would seriously make me wonder what the fuck was going on. “Another old white woman who is an arrogant scold and has insanely stupid scandals in her closet?”

    1. R C Dean

      “Why run her when we have so many POCs who are arrogant scolds and have insanely stupid scandals in their closet?”

      1. Pope Jimbo

        Technically, Warren is a POC – Piece of Color (1/1024).

    2. Stinky Wizzleteats

      She’s the worst, reminds me of a late 17th century spinster schoolmarm.

    3. “WITH VAGINA”

      I can get on board with using this as a criteria for power as long as I get to choose what’s surrounding said vagina.

  25. JaimeRoberto: Gentleman, Scholar, French Tickler

    Every time I hear about Warren’s plans I think of this: “The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design.”

    1. robc

      You know who else quoted an Austrian?

      1. BakedPenguin

        Thomas Edison?

      2. Mad Scientist

        Anyone who has ever said they’d be back?

  26. CPRM

    Uh, got my whole day derailed by stupid local news. I swear, I was going to work, I really was, but I just had to correct them. Damn mah brain!

    Last night on one of the Green Bay news stations they had a story about a produce truck that is run by a non-profit going around to ‘food deserts’. They were in a town near by talking about how the people there have to drive 20 minutes to buy fresh produce. Well muh brain says, ‘Well, golly, I ‘member them havin’ a grocery’. I tried to calm it down saying to myself, ‘maybe they just don’t sell produce there’.

    Well, I was trying to work and it was just bugging me. So instead of working I drove over to that town and took a peak in the store. Yep, fresh produce. So I took a picture and just now sent off an e-mail to the news station about proper reporting.

    Now to write a letter to the editor about kids not wearin onion belts no moar!

    1. Pope Jimbo

      How can the kids get onions for their belts when they live in a food desert? Shitlord status confirmed!

    2. Fatty Bolger

      America’s a food desert? That must explain why everybody looks like they’ve got a year’s worth of calories stored up. Human camels in the food desert.

  27. CPRM

    Oh, also a pic I took in a small town on my way back from meeting C. Anacreon.

    1. ElspethFlashman

      I like the little STEVELETS

  28. AlmightyJB

    Krugman. Face. So. Punchable. What a load of shit.

      1. AlmightyJB

        Would punch all!

        1. TARDIS

          Agreed. None of those shitbags have been economists for years. Face-punches all around, followed by 3-legged races to to the ER.

  29. AlmightyJB

    Warren’s just another opportunist who tries way too hard. Similar to Hillary in that regard.

    1. R C Dean

      Just waiting for Fauxcahontas’s “I ain’t noways tahrd” moment.