I Fucking Hate New York, Part II: The Self-Defensining

If you can remember back to this post, I was and am in the process of getting legal with the Empire State with respect to items that go BLAM!  A bit more than a year ago, I received permission from his most gracious and beneficent judge of Saratoga County to take possession and assume actual physical control of a handgun.  A (as in singular) handgun (a 1965 Ruger Standard with a 6″ barrel).

Ruger Mark I with a 6" barrel
There are many like it, but this one is MINE.

Since that time, I have amended that license a few times, paying $3 each time I had enough money lying around to add to the collection.   This license didn’t allow me to defend myself with it, that would still be very illegal.  But having had it for a year, and only having put holes in non-human objects I am now permitted to shell out another $200, spend another day in class and then re-apply to be granted such permissions as stopping for gasoline or lunch on the way to and/or from a gun range.

Why does this class cost $200?  Well first of all it can be.  Regulatory capture and all that.  But adding to that cost is undoubtedly this (underlining, bolding and italicizing in the original):

New York State Penal Law provisions including but not limited to the SAFE Act;
Article 35 (justification of the use of force); reporting requirements for the theft or
loss of a firearm or ammunition; where it is lawful to carry and possess a firearm;
and proactive awareness of surroundings, home, and car while carrying a firearm.
Classroom instruction on Penal Law Article 35 must be provided by an attorney licensed to practice in New York State.

NY looooves the shit out of its Top. Men.  So much so that it’s simultaneously trying to eradicate the NRA, but also relying on the NRA to determine when freemen can travel through the King’s Land with their weapons.

The class itself was ridonkulously basic and exactly like every other gun safety class you have ever been exposed to, with the one exception of the Article 35 review mentioned above.  That part was given by a lawyer that happened to be the club’s treasurer and gave off a whiff of gun-nuttery.  He was a enthusiastic fanboi of Massad Ayoob and encouraged us to subscribe to Combat Handgunner and because they both had columns written by Mr. Ayoob.  This lawyer’s reasoning was that if you have a subscription to these magazines, any article in them could be presented in your defense as training as part of the “reasonable person*” defense.  I have no idea how often this works, and didn’t ask him about his success rate in actual trials.

New York’s self defense laws are pretty straightforward if you follow the logic of “you need a really good reason to kill someone,” and “you need to de-escalate.”  However, there is a fuckton of nuance and interpretation in implementation that I am sure gets abused.  New York distinguishes between “Physical Force” and “Deadly Physical force”**  Basically, you have a duty to retreat in public, but do not have a duty to put yourself at a tactical disadvantage.  You cannot use Deadly Physical Force against someone that is only using Physical Force, unless the person is in the act of committing a kidnapping, a rape, or arson.  (Yes, in NY arson is the sole exception to being able to defend property with force).  There is a “castle doctrine,” but only to the extent that “duty to retreat” does not apply within a residence that you are authorized to be in.  You still can’t shoot (or stab or club) someone who is in your house unless they are attacking you or committing one of those aforementioned crimes, supra.  You can only defend an “innocent” third party (so that White Hispanic dude with the Kel-Tec would likely have been convicted in NY).

The lawyer also did something extremely useful, which was to pass out his business card which immediately went into the wallet because it is printed thusly:  ‘

Need to get this thing laminated

The rest of the course consisted of me getting yelled at by a Range Safety Officer for not having a correct shooting grip while practice drawing a rubber Sig P220 from a provided right-handed paddle holster.  I am not right-handed.

I did not muzzle myself or anyone else during the drills. But some people become RSOs to have an excuse to yell at people I guess.

Then we went for a live-fire qualification where I shot 500/500 on an AP1 target over distances ranging from 15 yards to 3, and with times allowed ranging from “completely adequate” to “literally forever.” The fact that this was considered a notable accomplishment makes me weep, and reminds me that the NRA was founded by a bunch of Civil War veterans from New York who were appalled by their cohort’s marksmanship (or lack thereof).  Apparently nothing has changed in the last 150 years.  I then received a suitable-for-framing certificate of completion and was told the correct way to request that my permit be switched to “unrestricted.”  There isn’t actually any indication on the forms that you want to do that.  You just ask to have a duplicate permit made and the nice ladies at the Sheriff’s Office (no sarcasm this time) are supposed to telepathically determine that you want an upgrade (though I suppose the fact that you hand them your certificate should be a big hint — still, there is no official paperwork AFAICT.)  This triggers another round  of background checks with now a higher standard for acceptance (or rather a lower bar for rejection***).  Again, this standard is completely at the whim of his most gracious judicial majesty of the County of X.  A rejection at this stage is appealable, but successful appeals have never happened ever in the history of “who the fuck do you think you are peasant?”  Unlike the initial permitting process, this upgrading is supposed to happen quickly.  We shall see.

*turns in paperwork*

*waits*

 

via GIPHY

*receives phone call from Sheriff’s Office.*  Apparently when I traded in my 22/45 for my Mark IV, the gun store paperwork got the gun I was trading in and the gun I was taking home BACKWARDS.  Fortunately the sheriff isn’t arresting me.  Yet.

*waits*

via GIPHY

One week later…

“Mr. Adahn, could you come down to the Sheriff’s office on [names two days of the week] between [names a three hour window]?  You’ll need to bring your pistol license with you.”

While this might be a trap, they already know where I live and that I’m (vaguely and lightly) armed, and they haven’t sent a SWAT team after me (yet).  So I go at the next opportunity (which is 20 hours later).  The nice ladies at the Sheriff’s office take a new picture of me, have me wait while they warm up the card printer, then have me wait some more while they warm up the card laminator.  Then they hand me a card very similar to my earlier one, only this one has the picture of a less fat guy on it, has my pistols printed on it instead of being written in sharpie, and most importantly, in the lower let corner it says UNRESTRICTED.  I am now less likely to commit a felony than I was before.

I celebrate by getting a coffee and bagel at a Panera drive through (French toast with cream cheese) while having a pistol in the car.

 

*NY’s “reasonable person” definition apparently includes that a reasonable person would have the same knowledge as the defendant.  Thus if you smoke someone who has a knife that is five yards away and you have been trained on the Tuller Drill, a “reasonable person” knows that an armed attacker within seven yards presents a lethal threat.

**Kicking someone barefooted is Physical Force.  Kicking someone with a shoe on is Deadly Physical Force.

***All of the information about this unrestricted permitting process makes it very clear that they will reject your ass for a single DUI.  You even have to acknowledge this before the class begins.  During the practice session for SSRG’s multi-gun event, I talked to three members who were avid clay shooters that were denied pistol permits for that very reason, which is why the club chose the “2×4” format for the matches.  You can’t assume that a NYS resident will be able to legally complete with a pistol.

Comments

257 responses to “I Fucking Hate New York, Part II: The Self-Defensining”

  1. Spudalicious

    I filled out a form, handed in proof of training, got fingerprinted, took a picture, and walked out. My license showed up in the mail 40 days later.

    1. Sean

      Training? Fingerprints?

      *falls out of chair*

      Also, I’m still a little jelly about constitutional carry states, even if PA is pretty decent.

      1. Spudalicious

        “Training”. I did a three hour pistol safety course on line. Now the only reason I have a permit is for other states. Open carry is in the state Constitution.

        1. Sean

          I respect people who OC, but it’s not for me. I like to be invisible.

          1. Agreed. I don’t understand why one would prefer to carry open if you can carry concealed.

            Missouri is Constitutional carry.

          2. Spudalicious

            Early on in this country, concealed carry was illegal. I OC when I’m hiking and grouse hunting.

          3. R C Dean

            Pretty hard to conceal a shotgun.

          4. dorvinion

            What others do or are comfortable in doing is their business. For my own personal rules, OC has a time and place.

            In town just isn’t the time or place for me.

            Out in the woods, just do what works.
            If all I’m carrying is a water bottle slung over my shoulder, then really no point in not concealing.
            If I’m toting the baby carrier, or some other pack with a waist strap, those aren’t exactly comfortable for traditional concealment methods, so its OC or don’t carry at all.

      2. Sensei

        Ask him about coming to NYC…

        I had a coworker in Westchester County who told me about going through all of this just six months ago. He was initially rejected and got an attorney and was one of the rare successes. Of course it added about another $500 to the cost…

      3. pistoffnick

        Fingerprints are a hard no for me.

        My buddy likes to tease me about it as he screws the silencer onto his pistol.

        “Nick, you could have one of these if you just give the man your fingerprints.”

        1. CPRM

          And that’s when you stab him (while wearing gloves) and take the silencer suppressor.

          JOKE!!!!

          1. Gender Traitor

            (while wearing gloves)

            Ummm…is THAT why UCS wears gloves…?

          2. Sir Digby

            Did you have an alternate theory, asked the mildly curious?

            Also, Howdy, all!

          3. Gender Traitor

            I guess I assumed he was just a bit…quirky… NTTIAWWT

            Also, Howdy, Diggy! (belatedly – just got out of the shower)

          4. CPRM

            – just got out of the shower

            Somebody is a tease.

          5. slumbrew

            just got out of the shower

            Go on…

          6. Sir Digby

            Ooooohh, dear….I think you just lit the perv signal, there, GT.

            NTTIAWWT…as you well know.

          7. slumbrew

            (for the record, attempting to be funny – I leave the pervy to the pros here)

          8. Gender Traitor

            …and put on my navy blue knit jammies and matching fuzzy slippers.

          9. Sir Digby

            Ooohh…fuzzy!

          10. CPRM

            …and put on my navy blue knit jammies and matching fuzzy slippers.

            Damn, are you reading my diary or checking my browser history!? This is creepy!

          11. Gender Traitor

            Nighty night, boys!

          12. Sir Digby

            I see–getting out while the gettin’s good, eh?

            G’night!

        2. I’ve been fingerprinted to get a job.

          1. Rhywun

            I swear I got fingerprinted for something as a kid – I wanna say teenage work permit?? But I don’t remember exactly.

          2. CPRM

            In the 80s they did toe prints for us kids, for some reason. But I’ve never been finger printed.

          3. They take babies’ footprint when they’re born.

          4. CPRM

            No, this was when I was pre-school age.

          5. Rhywun

            They take babies’ footprint when they’re born.

            Oh yeah, I remember that now.

            What on earth for??

          6. Used to be to identify that you got the right baby when you were discharged from the hospital.

            Basically, primitive chipping. I don’t remember if my mom’s footprint is on record, but mine is and I’m 51.

          7. Me, too, come to think of it, but that was a Boy Scout project at church. I don’t think it ever went anywhere. I still have it, as a matter of fact.

          8. CPRM

            Boy Scout project

            I didn’t know you were trans…woman…man…I got no fucking clue how that works.

          9. slumbrew

            “Boy Scout”
            “church”

            So triggering. I can’t even.

          10. So there were some Boy Scouts at church who needed to practice taking fingerprints, so I was voluntold with a bunch of other youth to submit.

          11. MikeS

            It was during a “YOUR KID IS GOING TO GET KIDNAPPED BY STRANGERS” scare. We all got printed thankfully, with our parents willing consent.

          12. slumbrew

            I was fingerprinted for my first co-op job, at 19. The Man has had a file on me forever.

            (all this fingerprint talk has me missing Patriot more than ever).

          13. Sir Digby

            Getting fingerprinted? Ha! I’ve been printed so many times, I lost count.

            I fingerprinted more people in a three year span than there are glibs.

            (all this fingerprint talk has me missing Patriot more than ever)

            QFFT

          14. CPRM

            I fingerprinted more people in a three year span than there are glibs.

            So you fingered a lot of people? Is there video proof? Or can you deny it as hear-say?

          15. Sir Digby

            Hmmmm….I doubt they’ve held on the the footage this long. I mean, would you?

            /don’t answer that

        3. Jarflax

          The things you have to pass on to avoid giving them your prints are legion. Many professions, many licenses, many State’s CCW permits, the military. Mine are on file for:

          2 liquor license applications
          My bar application
          My CCW application
          My permission to drive a car transporting foster kids (yes, that is in fact a thing)

          And even if you pass all that up, they will still take them if you are arrested.

    2. Gustave Lytton

      Copy of M9 pistol qualification from my files, signature of two people willing to vouch for me, fingerprints, fee, and mailed a couple of weeks later. Later in a new county, walk in with old permit, fill out form, take fingerprints, pay fee, and walk out with new permit. Same for renewal.

  2. Sean

    That was exhausting just to read.

    Sorry dude. Or is it congrats? I haz a confused.

  3. LJW

    I love living in flyover country. Took me 45 minutes to purchase and bring home my first gun and I still think that’s too long.

    1. You’re in OP or Olathe, aren’t you?

      1. LJW

        Yup Olathe

        1. Hey, put your avatar on!

          1. LJW

            Better?

          2. Yes, thank you! ?

          3. We’re not saying BEAM’s an alien, but . . .

            I loves me some doggos.  ? ? ?

  4. Count Potato

    I admire your perseverance.

    Believe it or not some other places are worse.

    1. Sean

      North Korea?

      1. I was going to say California.

        1. Count Potato

          DC, Chicago, SF, LA, etc.

          1. dbleagle

            Hawaii is worse, without a fucking doubt.

    2. We’re not saying BEAM’s an alien, but . . .

      Believe it or not some other places are worse.

      Let me tell you about my experience acquiring a PAL (Possession and Acquisition License) in Alberta, Canada (the province that’s most like Texas), d00d.

  5. Don Escaped Texas

    I had an Mk2. Sold it ’round 86: long story. Regret it still.

  6. Sean

    I was going to put up a pic of my impulse purchased AR “pistol” to torment you, but viewing the pic might be criminal in NY, and I don’t want to make you a criminal.

    Neener neener. Took @ 20 minutes to take ownership of and I can carry it in my car loaded. ?

    1. Yeah, I almost bought another pistol last Sat. Still need to take a CCH course – preferably before 1 Jan.

  7. Not too far away from the UK are we now?

    1. Sean

      I think he can still have pointy knives.

      1. Trigger Hippie

        Don’t forget about pointy sticks:

        https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2nde65

      2. Crusty Juggler
      3. kinnath

        My Iowa permit to carry weapons lets me carry this concealed.

        https://www.bladehq.com/item–Protech-Brend-3-Medium-Automatic–100458

        My permit allows me to carry a concealed pistol in about 30 other states, but most of those places won’t let me carry the knife. So on road trips, I have to be satisfied with a loaded handgun.

        1. Heroic Mulatto

          Coming from NH, and as a knife collector, the whole concept of knife laws seems North Korean.

          The only law we have is “don’t kill people with it.”*

          *Basically. There is a law prohibiting ‘brandishing’ in a school or other public buildings, but the concept of a permit to carry any blade concealed seems ghastly!

          1. Jarflax

            Yeah, like we are going to believe the thing you got in trouble for ‘brandishing’ was a knife.

          2. Heroic Mulatto

            Some people call it ‘the Blade’. I call it ‘Charlie Brown’.

    2. Trigger Hippie

      Hey Q, I have an idea for a debate topic. Recently I rehashed an old argument with an older friend about whether or not it’s a good idea to bring extinct species of plants and animals back into existence once we have the technology to do so. Not going to go into the argument in detail, but he’s against it and I say bring it on.

      Aside from the person taking the argument against it having a slight disadvantage, given what seems to be the reflexive aversion to the precautionary principle around here, it strikes me as a topic that doesn’t have a pillar rooted in any major political ideology.

      Food for thought.

      1. Count Potato

        Strife finds a way.

  8. Count Potato

    I regret to inform you, this person exists:

    “Why go see the family if NOT to start conversations and hold your racist relatives accountable? Otherwise you’d just be keeping a bunch of problematic people in your life”

    https://twitter.com/jenerous/status/1199444554182729729

    1. Rhywun

      “the holiday rooted in genocide”

      “Oh fuck, who invited that bitch? God damnit.”

      1. We’re not saying BEAM’s an alien, but . . .

        This “Jenerous” person is a witling. Just sayin’.

        1. Rhywun

          As in satire? Either way, I should just go back to avoiding Twitter.

          1. Jarflax

            Witling means fool

          2. Rhywun

            That’s what the dictionary tells me. I was just wondering if BEAM was making a point beyond the obvious.

    2. Bobarian LMD

      My Twitter response:

      Isn’t that what Thanksgiving is for?

      To crush your relatives, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of their women!

    3. Drake

      I don’t talk to other Whites about race, I start bragging after a couple drinks.

    4. Heroic Mulatto

      Thank you for speaking for me, White lady!

      It’s not like I get that in every other aspect of my life.

      1. Jarflax

        Don’t bring your false consciousness to her virtue party!

        1. Chafed

          Jesus she is insufferable. I’m surprised her family allows her to attend Thanksgiving.

      2. Florida Man

        SHUT THE FUCK UP…LIB…TRUMP… I don’t know which yard applies here.

        1. Florida Man

          Tard! Stupid SJW phone!

    5. Sir Digby

      Otherwise you’d just be keeping a bunch of problematic people in your life

      Yeah, nobody has time for that shit. Which is why I don’t know you, bitch.

  9. Crusty Juggler

    “I celebrate by getting a coffee and bagel at a Panera drive through”

    You deserve everything you get, monster.

  10. Nephilium

    I’m somewhat interested in trying out shooting, but I don’t need (another) expensive hobby. There is a range near me… that looks like they have a decent amount of options for rental.

    1. Don Escaped Texas

      ugh: we should have gone to the range at the pyramid

  11. Trigger Hippie

    God, reading that was a like eating a fresh slice of Hell. I have a rifle and a handgun, both of which are heirlooms, both of which I keep at my mother’s…because her boyfriend for the last twenty-five years is kind of a timid pussy. Helluva nice guy, and treats my mother well, but I’m not counting on him to be able to defend her with no guns in the house.

  12. Crusty Juggler

    The sheriffs are the good police.

    1. DrOtto

      Nicest Yugo on the lot.

  13. Bob Boberson

    “I did not muzzle myself or anyone else during the drills. But some people become RSOs to have an excuse to yell at people I guess.”

    This has been my experience with many RSO’s as well.

  14. Tejicano

    The contrast, on this issue, between where I live and the place I call home in the US couldn’t be more extreme.

    Here in Japan the only functional handgun I could possibly acquire would be an original cap & ball revolver which would have to have been registered continuously since about 1870. The cheapest examples I’ve seen start at about the equivalent of US$20k. And as far as I know I would not be able to purchase caps to shoot it with. There is no provision for violence in self defense in Japanese law.

    In my US home of record, New Mexico, any vehicle I am driving is a legal extension of my residence. I can legally drive around town with my full-auto MAC-10 with suppressor on the seat next to me – with or without a newspaper covering it.

    1. Florida Man

      Why not buy a gun from the Yakuza?

      1. Tejicano

        They generally won’t deal with foreigners.

        1. Florida Man

          That’s just bad business.

          1. Tejicano

            I’m not aware of any “business” the Yakuza is into which could be defined as a “good” business. It’s kinda the nature of the beast.

          2. Jarflax

            Sex, pharmaceuticals, weapons, protection! What’s wrong with those?

    2. Sensei

      That’s OK. You can always get a swor…. Oh, never mind carry on.

      1. Tejicano

        The purchase and registration paperwork & process for a sword is the same as for the above mentioned cap & ball revolver. It’s really simple – but in the end there is no legal right to defend yourself with or without any weapon. And the penalties for using either of these weapons against another person – regardless of who started it – are higher than if you used a baseball bat. Essentially, any implement used against another person which causes a cut or puncture would – even using a fork – breaks the Gun and Sword Law.

        In a court of law the judge will generally show leniency if he/she believes you were attacked by the other person first as long as you didn’t break the Gun and Sword Law. So there is some probability that you will get either a light sentence (or none at all) if you were attacked and responded with a baseball bat. However, in the same situation, had you responded with a table fork (causing a puncture wound) the stakes would be higher.

        1. What you did there, I see it.

      2. Gustave Lytton

        Not sure how well a jerry can of gas would work for self defense but…

        1. Tejicano

          I have sometimes wondered what the end effect would be – even in the US – if you carried a canister of gasoline, say about one quart, which you could use to quickly douse a would-be assailant. Then just stand back with a lighter in hand – let him decide if he is in any condition to get close to you at that point.

    3. commodious spittoon

      Tejicano

      In my US home of record, New Mexico

      Another hombre from the barrio!

      /he says, clenching his teeth, so white it hurts

      1. Tejicano

        I grew up in El Paso – but my dad eventually settled down in New Mexico so that’s where I ended up keeping my stuff.

    4. CPRM

      Don’t blame the Japanese, it was the US Government that seized all their weapons. Bye-bye 500 year heirloom sword! You fucked with ‘Merica!

      1. Tejicano

        No, that registration requirement was put in place at the beginning of the Meiji era – 150 years ago. America didn’t lift a finger to adjust it in any way – either good nor bad.

  15. Nephilium

    In other news today was completion of desserts (three types of cookies, and pumpkin beerimisu). Unfortunately, when roasting a second batch of coffee to make sure I had enough to get through the holiday, I knocked over the fscking roasting chamber. Replacements only cost ~$30, but shipping (and the holidays) means it won’t get here until next week. The beers are carbed up, porter came out a bit thin (but drinkable), cream ale is pretty much on (although a bit cloudy for the first pint, the next couple should clear it up).

    1. means it won’t get here until next week

      Couldn’t you roast in the oven? /coffee ignoramus

      1. Count Potato

        A friend of mind used a toaster oven.

      2. Nephilium

        Without some convection, it wouldn’t work as well. I’ve got a hot air popper (which will work for coffee roasting in a pinch, as well as spice roasting – Thanks AB!). You can roast in a cast iron skillet on the stove top, but you would want to keep stirring through the roasting time.

        1. Very interesting about the air popper. I’d never have thought of using it for anything other than popcorn. I have this popper. It’s awesome.

          1. Nephilium

            Use a cheesecloth across the top, and a rubber band to hold it in place. It’ll take ~10 minutes to roast the spices, and you won’t need to worry about burning the spices like you do when toasting them in a cast iron skillet on the stovetop. Haven’t tried it yet, but per AB it’ll make the kitchen smell great (and I can’t see him being wrong about that). And the coffee roaster is essentially a small scale hot air popper with controls for temperature, time, and fan speed (and a chaff collector, coffee blows off a lot of chaff when it’s roasted).

            For my hot air popper, I think it’s a $15-$20 one I picked up at Target with the Orville Redenbacher name slapped on it. It blows out hot air, pops popcorn, and breaks down a fair amount.

          2. I got mine at a thrift store for $5. It has no butter tray and the yellow plastic wobbles inside the thingie, but I put tape over the butter tray and just hold the yellow plastic do-hickey in place. It’s very nice when my hands are cold as they often are.

          3. Nephilium

            Mine’s got the butter tray, which I have never used. One of the few times I’ll use an easy artificial flavor is butter spray for popcorn. If I’m going for higher end popcorn, I’ll use ghee for my popcorn.

    2. Rhywun

      Your life sounds exhausting 🙂

      1. Nephilium

        There are times it’s good to have the quiet life. Tomorrow I pick up the cheese and meat platter I ordered from a local cheese maker, then make breads. Currently figuring on bacon cheddar buttermilk biscuits and some popovers (mainly because I got a popover pan, and have used it once).

        1. Florida Man

          Blessed are the cheese makers.
          -Jesus

          1. Gender Traitor

            Amen

          2. Nephilium

            I will see how the platter is before praising them too much. Cost about the same as buying all the supplies at Trader Joe’s, but came with a couple of extra items. Should be left with less leftovers as well (usually not a problem, but I’m going to be trying to get back into GlibFit).

          3. Gender Traitor

            Loves me some cheese! Speaking of Glibfit, I survived another round of Cycle & Sculpt. Getting a little easier. And I went commando in them cycling shorts, bitchezz! I may start trying that in other contexts…

          4. Nephilium

            Good for you for sticking with it. I do have a friend code for the MS Buckeye Breakaway, they’ve got options for 35, 62, 75, or 100 miles. Team Left Hand was a good one I rode with for a year.

          5. Gender Traitor

            August, huh? Maybe I’ll be in halfway decent shape by then.

          6. Nephilium

            Yep. Middle of summer, there was a reason that frozen items were popular at one of the rest stops. When I rode I did the 75, if you really want there’s an option to ride back on Sunday as well.

            If you do sign up, let me know, I’d need to sign up to try to maintain my manhood. 🙂

          7. Sir Digby

            I may start trying that in other contexts…

            Sounds like an article. Maybe not from/for here, mind you, but, still.

    3. Trigger Hippie

      To this day I’ve yet to drink a cream ale. Don’t know why, it’s looks like it’s not something I’d gag on like an IPA. I just never have it on my mind when I’m stocking up.

      1. Florida Man

        I like them. Give it a try. YOLO!

      2. Nephilium

        Think of it as a go to lawnmower beer. Light bodied, easy drinking, usually a mild sweetness (corn is acceptable in this style), low hopping rates. There aren’t too many nationally distributed ones I can think of off the top of my head, but most areas will have a local brewery or two that makes a good one. How do you feel about Kolschs, Blondes, Pilsners, and Helles lagers?

      3. creech

        Way way back when, Genesee Cream Ale would sometimes show up in Schmidt’s/Orliebs territory and we loved it just because it wasn’t Schmidts/Ortliebs.

    1. Heroic Mulatto

      How the fuck is an abortion “vegan”?

      1. Florida Man

        Because you don’t eat the fetus, obvi.

        1. You mean deep-fried fetus isn’t the new state fair midway concession?

          1. Florida Man

            It could be anything in that deep fried batter, so I can’t rule it out.

        2. Jarflax

          They use a carrot not a coathanger

        3. Nephilium

          Don’t you remove the brain of the fetus? Wouldn’t that make it a vegetable?

          /climbs into his handbasket.

    2. Rhywun

      I’ll just assume parody without further evidence.

      1. Chafed

        I was thinking parody account too.

    3. Raven Nation

      “I’ve always been fearful of sauerkraut”

      You know who else was fearful of sauerkraut…no, wait…is that right?

      *checks level in bottle of Irish whiskey*

      Who snuck into the house and drank that much?

      1. Nephilium

        “SMOKE BOMB!”

        /runs out of Raven Nation’s house

      2. Sir Digby

        You know who else was fearful of sauerkraut

        ::raises hand::

        Keep that nasty fucking shit the hell away from me, thankyouverymuch.

        1. CPRM

          Oh, then I unfriend you!

          1. Sir Digby

            You’ll make a friend, if you don’t have it around me.

    4. Meatless reuben.

      That’s a crime.

        1. LOL

          I have to keep a low profile on my reubens at home. Too many people around here (all but me, to be specific) who don’t like sauerkraut.

          WTF is wrong with the people I live with?

          1. Nephilium

            If you make it up here to Cleveland, we’ve got a pile of companies making small batch kraut.

          2. Chafed

            That’s pretty damn impressive.

  16. Gender Traitor

    Mr. GT & I recently renewed our CCW permits for a second time. Didn’t need additional training or testing – just filled out the forms, went to see the nice lady in the less-populated-than-ours adjacent county (which is a plus, as I suspect doing it in our own county would be much more of a hassle,) got fingerprinted, and paid the money. Mr. GT just had to go back a few days later to pick up the finished permits. The nice lady even let us keep the same photos from before, so it’s just as if I haven’t aged in five years!

    1. Don Escaped Texas

      panick

      runs to find wallet

      I renewed last year: I vaguely recall having thought about it just in time

      ok, next beer

      1. Florida Man

        FL is good for 7 years at a time. Renewal took 5 minutes.

    2. Woo hoo! Another armed mythical libertarian woman.

      I am now a disarmed mythical libertarian woman, which totally jacks my cred.

      1. Cannoli

        I am also a disarmed mythical libertarian woman, but I enjoyed my recent first trip to the range, so that may change soon. The CCW process in Georgia doesn’t look too bad. It’s not constitutional carry, but at least it’s shall-issue.

        1. I will not be able to arm myself for…quite a while for several reasons.

          I haz a sad.

          1. Cannoli

            I am sorry. I hope everything you’ve been going through lately gets better soon.

          2. Thanks.

            But to spread the misery, Cods & Cuntes is going to be delayed till the 15th.

          3. Cannoli

            All good, I look forward to reading it then.

    3. JaimeRoberto Delecto

      Renewing your CCW permits sounds more romantic than renewing your wedding vows.

  17. Don Escaped Texas

    Most OverRated!

    1 Minnesota
    2 Cincinnati
    2 Boise St
    2 Virginia Tech
    5 Utah
    6 Georgia

    Oregon (finally bagged and off the list!)

    Most UnderRated: Michigan

    1. CPRM

      I got to watch a re-broadcast of UNLV’s last game at Sam Boyd stadium. They won! I told you they weren’t over rated!

  18. straffinrun

    Did a quick google of Luger history and came across this:

    The Parabellum-Pistole (Pistol Parabellum), popularly (but incorrectly) known as the Luger,

    They don’t explain why. One of you know?

    1. Don Escaped Texas

      you dare question someone with a modem?

      1. Don Escaped Texas

        Was reading the wiki and it refers to “P08:” another thing to add to the list of things I knew when I was 12 but somehow don’t know four decades later.

        Also available in .45 ACP !

        1. Jarflax

          Does someone actually manufacture the .45 version today?

          1. Don Escaped Texas

            dk

            but it was a fun picture

            it wouldn’t be a good “pointer” for me: I find the Luger configuration too neutral; I can’t find it, swing it, or hold it on target

            I’m sure the design is ideal for some

    2. Jarflax

      Cause the guy who invented it was named Georg Luger

      1. straffinrun

        OK. But why is referring to it as a “Luger” wrong? Seems like a pedantic thing to point out.

        1. Jarflax

          It is. I’d assume the article was by a pedant.

          1. Jarflax

            It’s like people who point out that the Medal of Honor is incorrectly called the Congressional Medal of Honor. They are correct. They are giving you information. They are not being informative.

          2. straffinrun

            We need to give these people some Kleenex and band aids for their butthurt.

          3. Jarflax

            Well actually it is Band-Aids…

            *ducks and runs away, stops looks up thread.

            Ha you can’t do anything to me without getting in trouble.

          4. Gustave Lytton

            And those are awarded it, “won” their medal.

    3. Gustave Lytton

      the Luger’s 145° (55° for Americans) grip angle

      Someone’s holding it in the wrong direction.

      1. CPRM

        Their degrees are in Celsius, duh!

        1. kinnath

          Kelvin

        2. Don Escaped Texas

          55°C ~ 131°F

          close?

    1. Rhywun

      Define “better”.

      1. straffinrun

        What the author believes. Pure arrogance in practice.

    2. CPRM

      And, just out of curiosity, how well do those companies do…

      (I’m not reading the article)

    3. commodious spittoon

      global laggard Latin America at 7%

      Oh my God, Karen, you can’t just call someone laggard!

      1. Rhywun

        Laggard, please.

          1. commodious spittoon

            This isn’t why Chappelle is cancelled.

          2. CPRM

            Because he said the N! word!?

          3. Don Escaped Texas

            I like this avatar but also miss Groundskeeper Willie or whatever it was

  19. Gender Traitor

    Speaking of things that go bang, watching Weaponology on “American Heroes Channel,” (“AHC” – undoubtedly to ease the eventual morph into “Aliens & Hitler Channel”) and the now-tranny historian is popping up here pre-transition. Looked better then.

    1. Gender Traitor

      …and sounded MUCH better!

    2. now-tranny historian

      The first time I saw her, I said, “That’s a man, baby!” Looked her up. Sure enough.

      1. CPRM

        Of who do you speak? *crosses fingers* Don’t be Bethany Hughes, don’t be Bethany Hughes*

        1. Gender Traitor

          Dr. Aryeh (IIRC – doing this from short-term memory)/Lynette Nussbaum. Pops up in a bunch of History Channel (& related channels) shows, especially re: military history.

          1. Sir Digby

            Nussbaum…..Nussbaum….Seems I’ve heard that name before.

            Oh, yeah! It must have been the husband, or, his voucher.

        2. CPRM

          Sorry, Bettany, she’s a damn brit so she don’t English good like us does.

          1. Gender Traitor

            Oops! I sit corrected. Short-term memory’s the second thing to go, but I forget what the first thing is.

          2. LOL.

            Meh, I spent way too much time looking for the e with the accent to copy and paste.

          3. slumbrew

            Option-e

            é
            ó
            á

            etc.

            Unless you’re on not-a-Mac. Then I can’t help you.

            I still don’t know what the ‽ keycombo is – I just have that saved as an Alfred snippet.

          4. Rhywun

            I still don’t know what the ‽ keycombo is – I just have that saved as an Alfred snippet.

            There isn’t one and holy crap you’re a nerd.

            PS. LaunchBar FTW.

          5. Don Escaped Texas

            I’ve got an excel tab that has all the symbols I need (technical, German, Spanish, French) so I can just copy paste to whatever I’m working on.

            I looked them up once and now they’re there forever. Most of them can be Googled or looked up each time, but I’m the do it once and have it done and enjoy the efficiency forever kind of guy.

            é¡¿ç!

          6. slumbrew

            PS. LaunchBar FTW.

            Dang, that’s still going? Fooled around with that, then QuickSilver for quite a while.

            Alfred kicks a lot of ass – I bought the Power Pack early on and have never regretted it.

            I still get a lot of “how did you do that?” from co-workers whenever I’m screen-sharing during a meeting; the shortcuts into our CMDB save so much time.

          7. not-a-Mac

            I am not on a Crapple, no.

          8. slumbrew

            As a technology professional, I don’t get the Mac-hate.

            Unix with a pretty face. What’s not to like?

          9. Rhywun

            Yeah, it’s still alive. I’ve tried them all; I was using LaunchBar before Alfred came out and they’re pretty much equivalent so why change. Though Alfred does seem to be the more popular one now.

          10. Rhywun

            Unix with a pretty face. What’s not to like?

            My professional life is Windows-only. *shrugs*

          11. slumbrew

            My professional life is Windows-only. *shrugs*

            That was the case when I was at State Street – I just used my Windows machine to run a Linux VM at that point.

            $current_job is when I switched to a Mac. I could go back to Linux. Never back to Windows.

            Admittedly, I still bear a grudge from when Microsoft did their best to FUD Linux into oblivion (remember the SCO lawsuit they underwrote? I do).

          12. My school district issues Macs.

            I have a very old Mac a client gave me to do a project for him on it. Then he died. It’s mine now, which is good because I do need it for my work. I have an iPad, also which I need for my work.

            I have a Nano, but I never use it. I can’t stand iTunes. I can get my music onto my phone in a much easier, more streamlined fashion.

            When I can be arsed to type “Cr” in front of “apple,” it’s my irritation showing. Irritation with their walled garden. But! Even if I weren’t irritated by their walled garden, I could never afford one of those.

            The price point simply isn’t for people like me.

          13. slumbrew

            The price point simply isn’t for people like me.

            The low end is more reasonable than you may thing, but that’s a fair point – you can find a Windows machine that will be cheaper than the cheaper Mac.

            Depending on what you’re doing, the Mac’s advantage will be more or less meaningless (i.e., you spend no time at a command-prompt, you hear “git” and just think of us here, etc.).

            On a related note, I’m t

          14. slumbrew

            On a related note, I’m t

            As I was saying, I’m this close to just taking away my mother’s Windows machine and making her do everything on an iPad or Chromebook. I can’t deal with the tech-support calls anymore.

          15. My husband does the IT stuff around here, and he loves doing the hardware. I CAN do it; I just don’t want to.

            I like being able to completely and totally control my computer’s environment. You should see how finely I drill down my folders and my disk drives and whatnot. We have a home cloud. We are, actually, quite sophisticated.

            But we like Windows because we can control it, control what goes in and out, what gets upgraded and what doesn’t, what’s under the hood.

            My husband did build a Hackintosh for me once. I did need it (before I got dead guy’s Mac), but I hated using it because of his desk. He didn’t mind that I didn’t use it. He likes being able to say he did it.

            Heh…memory lane now.

            When he and I first got married, I got pregnant right away. We had discussed that we both wanted me to be at home for the kids, but knew we couldn’t afford it, so I would have to find a work-at-home job. Okay, this happened, but my old computer couldn’t handle the workload, so we bought me a new computer.

            It came while I was at work.

            By the time I got home, the new computer was up and running and my husband was so proud he had done something humongous for me (that he thought I probably couldn’t do or didn’t want to do)–and I was livid.

            That was the last time he ever messed with a computer I was using without my asking him to do something specific that I’m too lazy to do.

            “Honey, I would like a solid-state drive, please.”

            “No problem!”

            But he has also rescued me when I lost data from failing hard drives. He knows how to do that. In fact, just last week I needed him to rescue a file off a flash drive I accidentally fried (long story short: tried to back up my Pinterest account with outdated and unsupported software).

          16. Rhywun

            I can’t deal with the tech-support calls anymore.

            Ugh been there.

          17. CPRM

            I’m not a fan of Windows nor Apple OS, I’m a fan of PCs VS Macs. Being able to choose which components are in my computer build, that’s what matters to me, and Apple has stricter control over that, so not a fan.

          18. slumbrew

            But we like Windows because we can control it, control what goes in and out, what gets upgraded and what doesn’t, what’s under the hood.

            With respect, that’s utterly not the case if you’re running Windows (or OS X). You may feel it’s so, but it’s not actually so. It’s certainly no more the case with Windows than a Mac.

            If you want that level of control, you need to be running something open source and compiling from scratch. And compiling your compiler from scratch.

            But that’s a huge time commitment (I did it for years, save bootstrapping the compiler from hand-written assembler). You have to make trade-offs.

            I’m not shitting on your choice – if you’re happy with what you have, so be it, just be aware of what level of control you actually have.

            It’s better than any phone OS, but Windows is hardly fully under your control.

          19. slumbrew

            Being able to choose which components are in my computer build, that’s what matters to me

            That’s a perfectly cromulent reason. As a incredibly infrequent gamer, I care not a whit, but I can see where one would.

          20. CPRM

            Of fuck, you go through all that and don’t get a nose job? (Or did they get a nose job and an ugly nose was their true self?)

          21. Rhywun

            Enh, at least she’s reasonably convincing in that photo.

            embrace their proud identity

            Sigh. It’s the new “for the children”. You don’t hate people who embrace their proud identity, do you?

            Well–

            Hater!

          22. she’s reasonably convincing in that photo

            And ONLY in that photo. She does not make a convincing woman AT ALL.

          23. Rhywun

            Heh. It’s almost like there are real differences between the sexes that can’t just be pancaked or skin-grafted over.

          24. slumbrew

            It’s almost like there are real differences between the sexes that can’t just be pancaked or skin-grafted over.

            *points and makes screeching noises*

          25. Chafed

            William Gibson’s future begs to differ.

          26. slumbrew

            William Gibson’s future begs to differ.

            Which one? There are several to choose from. I still default to:

            They sent a slamhound on Turner’s trail in New Delhi, slotted it to his pheromones and the color of his hair. It caught up with him on a street called Chandni Chauk and came scrambling for his rented BMW through a forest of bare brown legs and pedicab tires. Its core was a kilogram of recrystallized hexogene and flaked TNT.

          27. Chafed

            I was thinking of Neuromancer but probably his first 4(?) books apply.

  20. KSuellington

    Wow, I thought California was bad. That is an insane process.

    1. Gustave Lytton

      Only a matter of time.

      1. KSuellington

        Yeah, I know. We just got a terrible ammo background check law passed this year. We are slowly becoming New York here.

        1. Gustave Lytton

          And right behind you to the north.

  21. straffinrun

    Today’s advice column is hawt. Copy and paste the headline and run through google translate.
    https://www.yomiuri.co.jp/jinsei/20191126-OYT8T50077/

    1. “Mr.” and “female”. Aka hentai?

    2. slumbrew

      I’ve seen a documentary…

    3. CPRM

      3 of “I don’t agree with my friends … how can I divide it?”

      Ok.

    4. straffinrun

      TL;DR

      My teacher isn’t popular or good looking, but despite that I starting seeing him in a sexual way. I can’t get him out of my head. I pretend to not understand the lesson so I can ask him questions and also ask him about human relationships. I want him to wrap me in his arms once I graduate. It’s embarrassing. Why do I have these feelings.

      B. In Chiba.

        1. slumbrew

          It took me forever to understand the lyric as “that book by Nabokov” (a book I loved when I read it).

          1. What did you think it was?

          2. CPRM

            Bathroom on the right?

          3. slumbrew

            Nothing coherent – “that that now because”? TBF, I was a pre-teen the first time I heard it and Lolita wasn’t exactly assigned reading at that age. (nor now, I expect – so problematic, no doubt).

            I’m not sure if that was my first unreliable narrator book, but I love them so.

            I’d list them, but part of the joy is finding out they’re an unreliable narrator.

        2. straffinrun

          Good call. I imagine every male teacher at all girls schools in Chiba is checking their attendance list for girls with names that begin with “B”.

          1. slumbrew

            Excellent.

            She has freaky-long fingers, as most good guitarists seem to.

          2. I am never going to be that cool. *sigh*

          3. straffinrun

            The mask adds the necessary mystery.

          4. I assumed she didn’t want to be identified. Her hair hides what the mask doesn’t.

          5. straffinrun

            Probably. Also, she could be anywhere from 16~35 years old. Hard to tell.

          6. Gustave Lytton

            Reminded me of a YouTube channel I occasionally watch. Japanese living in Taiwan that compulsively wears a face mask. In one of the eating shows, she didn’t angle the camera far enough while eating without her mask so blurred her face entirely.

      1. CPRM

        So you’re saying now that I’m jobless I should move to Japan and become a teacher? I’m in!

        1. straffinrun

          Why not?

  22. pistoffnick

    Soda stream has stopped offering their 60 liter size of CO2 canisters.

    We get shipments packed in dry ice once a week at work. They leave it on the dock to sublimate.

    I brought some home, measured out 400 grams (tank says 410 grams capacity), depressurized my “empty” tank, unscrewed the brass top, and filled it with dry ice pellets (my chopstick skills are still up to scratch).

    It has come up to room temperature and hasn’t exploded yet.

    To think I used to pay $15 to exchange tanks.

    1. slumbrew

      Soda stream has stopped offering their 60 liter size of CO2 canisters.

      Oh, don’t I know it.

      *grumble*

      Local guy says it’s because of liability around shipping the larger canisters.

      I am jealous? terrified? of your ingenuity. Please don’t die due to shrapnel.

      I am giving serious thought to one of the paintball tank adapters

  23. slumbrew

    I am at my MIL’s, en route to NY for various Thanksgiving events, with both my wife’s family and mine.

    I have, for the first time, brought a flask and have just filled it with some 14-year-old Oban from the bar here (for clarity – I bought the Oban, I just keep it here – also, I’m drinking some right now).

    I’m not sure if I’ve crossed a Rubicon with the flask, but it seem prudent, even if it goes unused.

    1. Don Escaped Texas

      Oban is never a mistake

      1. slumbrew

        True, true.

        I’ve got a bit of Caol Ila left there too.

        My deceased FIL was a Scotch fan and had a nice collection – nobody touched it after his death until I started dating now-wife.

        Early on, I got some unwitting bonus points for saying 1) yes, I like Scotch and 2) enjoying it the way Arnold did (with a single cube to open it up a bit).

        I try to keep it reasonably stocked in his memory – one of my great regrets (? maybe not the right emotion) is not meeting him before he passed. Many, many people have assured me that we would have gotten along like a house on fire.

    2. Chafed

      You gave it a nice home.

    3. straffinrun

      Have fun. Christmas music in the stores already. *sighs*

      1. CPRM

        A benefit of being fired, one of the stations I used to work for switched to ‘All Christmas’ the day I was fired. The worst time of year.

        1. Gustave Lytton

          Nah, there’s always time for Gingle Bells.

  24. CPRM

    After watching it for like 10th time, I realized I put the Hat on the wrong side of the desk in the newest episode, he might be another Rushun plant!